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Tempted by two languages... | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Advice Center |  | |
| jtmc18 Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 7248 days ago 119 posts - 140 votes  Speaks: English*, Spanish | Message 1 of 14 23 April 2014 at 5:24pm | IP Logged |
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I've been obsessed with Spanish for almost ten years, and have reached a strong level in the language, which I've been told is probably C1. A few years ago I decided it was time to study another language in the Romance group, and initially I attempted French, as this language is common in my workplace. I couldn't get interested in it much, however, and then I had the opportunity to travel to Italy. I then chose Italian and am now at an intermediate level in the language. Now it's time to choose a third language, and while French is always in the background, waiting to be learned (more for practical reasons than for desire), I think I'd rather take up Brazilian Portuguese or Russian for now. Both languages fascinate me and, thanks to world events, both are in the spotlight this year. I probably shouldn't, however, study both at the same time, as I'm still maintaining my Spanish, refining my Italian, and working full-time, etc.
I have a copy of the new Assimil Portugues de Brasil (Spanish version) and a copy of The New Penguin's Russian Course, which gets rave reviews. I want to begin one or the other this summer. Here are my arguments in favor of each language: 1) Portuguese: I love the music from Brazil and someday would like to visit this great country. It seems that I meet Brazilians everywhere I go, and they are almost always very friendly and excited to practice their language with me. I can already understand much of the language, having taken two semesters of it in college several years ago, and it is so similar to Spanish and Italian that there are few grammatical hurdles to overcome. Also, the World Cup is taking place in Brazil this year. 2) Russian: I've always been curious about this language, as I know virtually nothing about it except that it's said to be complicated. It represents something new and mysterious to me, unlike the Romance languages which are so familiar (even French isn't really novel). I also tend to meet a lot of Russian speakers in my work and travels, and because I spend my summers in Alaska, I get exposed to a fair amount of Russian history and culture. Also, world events are again placing the spotlight on this language, and I feel that it would be beneficial to know it. My arguments against each language are as follows: 1) Portuguese: I have enough trouble keeping Spanish out of my Italian, and I'm worried that both languages could interfere with my Portuguese. In fact, I've caught myself speaking Italian to Brazilians on a few occasions. While my listening skills in Italian are strong, my speaking skills are not and I don't know if I should wait until these are more solid before embarking on yet another Romance language. In retrospect, I probably should have chosen Portuguese instead of Italian from the start, given its greater prevalence and better practice opportunities, but I don't know if I should abandon the latter for the sake of the former at this point. 2) Russian: I only know three words in this language, and I've heard that it is hard. I've never studied a language with cases before, unless a brief foray into German counts. Also, I wonder if Russian speakers are as open to practicing their language with strangers as Brazilians have been. I have no experience trying, so I don't know... I know that over time I could theoretically pursue both, but given that I tend to dedicate a few years to the languages I study- and life gets in the way- I may only ever learn one. I know that the question is subjective, but if your languages were English, Spanish and Italian, and you had an equal fascination in both Portuguese and Russian, which one would you choose? Are there any pros and cons I haven't thought of from a learning perspective? I rely on your wisdom and experience for insight... Edited by jtmc18 on 23 April 2014 at 5:26pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| iguanamon Pentaglot Senior Member Virgin Islands Speaks: Ladino Joined 5265 days ago 2241 posts - 6731 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, Portuguese, Haitian Creole, Creole (French) | Message 2 of 14 23 April 2014 at 6:41pm | IP Logged |
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You know what my choice is by looking at my profile :). That being said don't shy away from Russian just because it's harder for English-speakers. Interference, yeah, it's there but it can be worked on by forcing yourself to switch between the languages and by not pushing Spanish to one side while learning the new language. There's a price to pay for learning languages and maintaining them as you go is part of it- if you want to keep your levels high.
Some people use one to learn the other and they have a point. For me, that's not what I did. My using Spanish to learn Portuguese was not a matter of a base in a course. My base language for learning was Portuguese. So it was more a matter of leveraging my knowledge of Spanish to inform my Portuguese. It worked for me. If I've been speaking Spanish for an extended period, it will creep in to my Portuguese if I'm not careful. After a short time speaking Portuguese, no problem. Same for Spanish- for me. Both Russian and Brazilian/Luso cultures are vibrant and worthy. I've never been to Russia but I will, some day ¡Ojalá!. That being said, there's more than enough literature, films, music, Brazilians, Brazil and lusophone countries to keep me busy and happy for a long time. Good luck and if I can help, let me know. Edited by iguanamon on 23 April 2014 at 7:14pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Expugnator Hexaglot Senior Member Brazil Joined 5169 days ago 3335 posts - 4349 votes Speaks: Portuguese*, Norwegian, French, English, Italian, Papiamento Studies: Mandarin, Georgian, Russian | Message 3 of 14 23 April 2014 at 7:00pm | IP Logged |
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I might be biased so I'll just say that Russians are as 'online easy-going' as Brazilians. Actually, it is common knowledge that Brazilians and Russians have a similar character, despite the differences in climate etc.
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| Solfrid Cristin Heptaglot Winner TAC 2011 & 2012 Senior Member Norway Joined 5337 days ago 4143 posts - 8864 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, Spanish, Swedish, French, English, German, Italian Studies: Russian | Message 4 of 14 23 April 2014 at 9:07pm | IP Logged |
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A few years ago a faced a similar choice. I was allowed to take classes in any language I wanted, as long as I
could argue that it would be useful for my job, and considered Portuguese, Dutch, Polish and Russian. I figured Portuguese would be easy due to my French, Spanish and Italian, Dutch would be easy due to my Norwegian, English and German, Polish I had already studied a little a few years before, and Russian - I did not know at all. Call me masochistic, but I chose Russian. I sometimes feel that I could have learned the three others in the time it has taken me NOT to learn Russian, but I have no regrets. Russian is an amazing language, and Russians, as long as you avoid the ones in charge of something - receptionists, metro attendants, or shop assistants - are the warmest, nicest people you can imagine. I do not think I know any Brazilians, so I cannot compare, but the Russians I have met often remind me of Spaniards. They can often be very direct, but they are hospitable and very kind. Take Russian! You may regret it many times along the way, but you will not regret it in the end :-) Edited by Solfrid Cristin on 24 April 2014 at 7:57am 3 persons have voted this message useful | |
| Tomohiro Octoglot Newbie Japan Joined 4346 days ago 20 posts - 41 votes Speaks: Japanese*, Korean, Galician, GermanC2, SpanishC2, Portuguese, Mandarin, English Studies: Russian, Old English, Armenian | Message 5 of 14 24 April 2014 at 1:01am | IP Logged |
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jtmc18
Both languages seem to be very interesting. Since you have an advanced level in Spanish, Brazilian Portuguese will not be that difficult for you, given the lexicon and grammar similarity. You will need to work on idioms, false cognates and other details; however, language interference will be solved by practice and it is completely normal even for native speakers. You do not need to worry about it unless it doesn’t let you to be comprehended by other people. By choosing Brazilian Portuguese, from my experience, it will take less time to maintain those three romance languages in the future. Abandoning a language might be difficult, but if you don’t see any point to read some news, interesting books, watch TV news, documentaries, TV series, TV shows or films, listen to music, talk to native or fluent speakers in the target language, visiting the country etc, then, perhaps it is time for you to decide not to keep on learning it anymore. If you are struggling to either study or maintain your current level and if it is a language required at your job, home etc, you can start with Brazilian Portuguese. Mr. Iguanamon mentioned literature and I agree with him. There are great literature works written in this language by authors such as Guimarães Rosa, Machado de Assis, Euclides da Cunha, among others. I am not sure if you are interested in what most scholars consider to be one of the best Brazilian literature works, though. However, I won’t agree with him concerning films since I have a different taste, standard and criteria. There are only few good films in my opinion. Brazilian music may vary a lot and it all depends on your style. Anyway, they are easy to find on Youtube or any other similar website. I am going to start a log related to Russian. Despite the fact that I know only a few words and that I have not started studying yet, I will give you some of my impressions. I have been to Russia and I think it was an interesting experience. As Ms. Solfrid Cristin said, if you talk to people who are not in charge of something, you will figure out that most of them tend to be very nice and warm. Sometimes they were very directly and I felt the cultural differences and I tried to understand their point of view. I am interested in Russian culture, history, cuisine, arts, music, films, literature, philosophy, religion (I would like to read more about Orthodox Christianity) and Slavic linguistics (syntax, morphology, phonology and lexicon). Generally speaking, I think there are more interesting works in Russian than Brazilian Portuguese, considering the field above. As I said, this is my opinion based on my own goals and personal criteria. Russian will be more challenging for you at the beginning, since you are not used to the lexicon and, perhaps, some grammar topics. However, it will be wonderful experience that you will not regret. Solfrid Cristin Challenging is more fun for me. I am going to challenge in May 1st, starting from the scratch without any previous experience in Slavic languages. One day I will understand the ‘headache’ many people had. Until that day, I am not going to stress about anything. Good luck for me! 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6600 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 6 of 14 24 April 2014 at 1:23am | IP Logged |
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No offence meant but I think you don't really know what you're getting yourself into :) I strongly recommend you to spend some time dabbling in Russian before making any commitments.
Also, the way I see it, you really have three questions: -should I stop learning Italian? -when to start Portuguese? -shall I give Russian a try? To answer in the reversed order, you'll never be sure about Russian until you try, and you probably need to compare the pros and cons of starting Portuguese now vs later. As for Italian, if you lost motivation after the trip, don't feel guilty. Being already fluent in Spanish, you won't lose your comprehension skills if you stop/take a break. But as you can see, I'm learning all three Romance languages. Are you maybe bored of doing the same stuff all over again, with coursebooks for English native speakers? See the thread about the multitrack approach.* See this technique too. Also, I'm currently using this book to see where I'm generalizing too much based on my strongest Romance language, Portuguese... and learning about some peculiarities of Spanish too in the process. I also absolutely adore Radio Arlecchino. If none of my links make you excited, maybe you need a break from Italian. But it seems like you're at the same point where you were with French. If there's a problem, starting a different Romance language won't solve it. *Be sure to check, um, basically all the links I posted. the techniques, the strategies for books and music. GLOSS, which is available for Portuguese and Russian. Lyricstraining, which officially has Portuguese and Italian (among others), and where YnEoS has uploaded one song in Russian too. Speaking of that, you may be interested in this thread as well. Also, PM me if you're interested in watching football online, whether in Portuguese or Russian :) Edited by Serpent on 24 April 2014 at 1:31am 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Fuenf_Katzen Diglot Senior Member United States notjustajd.wordpress Joined 4372 days ago 337 posts - 476 votes Speaks: English*, German Studies: Polish, Ukrainian, Afrikaans | Message 7 of 14 24 April 2014 at 1:47am | IP Logged |
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I wouldn't necessarily underestimate language interference. Spanish may very well creep into any other language you choose (including Russian), though obviously not to the same extent as it could with Portuguese. The Russians I have run into have all been eager to speak Russian with others.
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| chokofingrz Pentaglot Senior Member England Joined 5192 days ago 241 posts - 430 votes Speaks: English*, French, Spanish, German, Italian Studies: Russian, Japanese, Catalan, Luxembourgish | Message 8 of 14 24 April 2014 at 3:53pm | IP Logged |
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The adult human brain gets slower with every year.
Study the more difficult language (Russian) while you still have some brain cells left. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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