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German "ch" | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Questions About Your Target Languages |  | |
| Raistlin Majere Trilingual Hexaglot Senior Member Spain uciprotour-cycling.c Joined 7154 days ago 455 posts - 424 votes  7 sounds Speaks: English*, Spanish*, Catalan*, FrenchA1, Italian, German Studies: Swedish | Message 1 of 17 27 June 2005 at 2:00pm | IP Logged | ||
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I would be very grateful to any forum member, especially to those who are native German speakers, who could help me out with this problem I have.
In all German textbooks it is specified that the sound ch is different if preceded by "e/i" or "a/o/u"; the former sounding more or less like "dish" and the latter like "hat". In the cassettes and CDs that accompany them, this distinction is made as well. But when I hear native German speakers talking in German, the sound in words such as "ich, Pech, vielleichts" sound very much the same to me as the sounds of "doch, auch, Macht". So, I need your help to know, once and for all, how is the "ch" pronounced in German. Thanks! 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Martien Heptaglot Senior Member Netherlands martienvanwanrooij.n Joined 7107 days ago 134 posts - 148 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, German, Spanish, Turkish, Italian, French Studies: Portuguese, Serbo-Croatian, Latin, Swedish, Arabic (Written) | Message 2 of 17 27 June 2005 at 2:52pm | IP Logged | ||
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As far as I know it depends on the region the speaker comes from. For me the word "ich" in Standard German in the beginning sounded the same as -sh in fish so an English transcription could have been "eesh". However you are supposed to rise the middle of your tongue a little bit towards the roof of your mouth (palatum durum, sorry I don't know the right English word). Words like "lachen" have a ch as in Scottish "loch" .However the ch in ich in some dialects seems to be completely like sh in fish and ch in lachen is still more "scrapy" then ch in Scottish loch, it sounds like the Arabic kha in words like khobz (bread).
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| Raistlin Majere Trilingual Hexaglot Senior Member Spain uciprotour-cycling.c Joined 7154 days ago 455 posts - 424 votes 7 sounds Speaks: English*, Spanish*, Catalan*, FrenchA1, Italian, German Studies: Swedish | Message 3 of 17 27 June 2005 at 2:58pm | IP Logged | ||
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I have tried the palatal "ch" as you suggest, and it is the one I use when I speak in German with words such as "ich, rechts...", but I have never heard a German native use it; they use the same "ch" in all cases, and that's what I can't understand. Edited by Raistlin Majere on 27 June 2005 at 3:01pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| jradetzky Triglot Senior Member United Kingdom geocities.com/jradet Joined 7209 days ago 521 posts - 485 votes 1 sounds Speaks: Spanish*, EnglishC2, GermanB1 | Message 4 of 17 27 June 2005 at 3:42pm | IP Logged | ||
That is true in Thüringen (Dresden, Jena) but not in Hochdeutsch. I think the "h" sound at the beginning of the word "human" in English is a better approximation to "ch" after i and e. Greek and Latin American Spanish have that sound too. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| victor Tetraglot Moderator United States Joined 7320 days ago 1098 posts - 1056 votes 6 sounds Speaks: Cantonese*, English, FrenchC1, Mandarin Studies: Spanish Personal Language Map | Message 5 of 17 27 June 2005 at 3:43pm | IP Logged | ||
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If I remember correctly, -ch in "ich" is pronounced as [ç] while "ch" in "auch" is [x]. Would that be your problem?
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| jradetzky Triglot Senior Member United Kingdom geocities.com/jradet Joined 7209 days ago 521 posts - 485 votes 1 sounds Speaks: Spanish*, EnglishC2, GermanB1 | Message 6 of 17 27 June 2005 at 3:54pm | IP Logged | ||
You're absolutely right. The "ç" sound is like "h" at the beginning of "human" and the one employed for "ich", "zwanzig", "echt", "euch", etc. The "x" (doch, acht, Buch) sound is like the Scottish ch in "loch" or European Spanish j in "joder", "ajo". Edited by jradetzky on 27 June 2005 at 3:55pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Raistlin Majere Trilingual Hexaglot Senior Member Spain uciprotour-cycling.c Joined 7154 days ago 455 posts - 424 votes 7 sounds Speaks: English*, Spanish*, Catalan*, FrenchA1, Italian, German Studies: Swedish | Message 7 of 17 27 June 2005 at 4:06pm | IP Logged | ||
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Thanks very much, I see now that "ich" is rarely pronounced "eesh", and that it's more common to say "ih".
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| victor Tetraglot Moderator United States Joined 7320 days ago 1098 posts - 1056 votes 6 sounds Speaks: Cantonese*, English, FrenchC1, Mandarin Studies: Spanish Personal Language Map | Message 8 of 17 27 June 2005 at 4:10pm | IP Logged | ||
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I haven't had much trouble with this, really. [ç] exaggerated would be "heee" and [x] a "hoh" just like those peppermint/gum advertisements where they feel for that refreshing feeling.
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