Success with Heisig? (Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies) Language Learning Forum

Success with Heisig?
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Language Learning Forum : Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies

11 messages over 2 pages: 1 2 Next >>

Cyborg Ninja
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Message 1 of 11

08 July 2010 at 8:18am | IP Logged

I'd like to know how successful people have been in the long run with Heisig's "Remembering the Kanji." Many people start the regimen before studying any other part of Japanese. I'd like to know how those who have tried the method feel it has helped now that they have been studying the language for a long time (if you have, of course). Has it helped or has it been detrimental?
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theallstar
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Message 2 of 11

08 July 2010 at 10:04am | IP Logged

I finished RTK about 6 months ago and it's been a massive boost to my studies. Before I started it I saw kanji as a huge monster that seemed impossible to master. This was compounded by the fact that I'd studied about 200 by tradition methods and my projections on how long this was going to take were nothing short of depressing. Now that I've got RTK (book 1 only) out of the way I almost don't think about kanji at all. Sure, I don't know the readings for a lot of them but as I learn more and more words the readings just stick. The key benefit is that you will recognise most kanji that you see. The only downside is that I took about a year out from studying the language itself (though I think I took longer than most to finish RTK).

On a side note, I've not had much problem with kanji that aren't taught in the book yet. I guess as I become more advanced I might encounter these more often though I should be able to apply the same methods to learning them (and I might even go through RTK3 at some point).
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patuco
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Message 3 of 11

08 July 2010 at 1:40pm | IP Logged

theallstar wrote:

I might even go through RTK3 at some point

Do you recommend skipping RTK2 and going straight to RTK3?

I'm asking because I'm going to start RTK1 mid-August and, although I hope to finish by early 2011, I'm not sure whether to continue with the second and third volumes.
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theallstar
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Message 4 of 11

08 July 2010 at 2:51pm | IP Logged

patuco wrote:

Do you recommend skipping RTK2 and going straight to RTK3?

I've only really had a brief look over RTK2. Whilst it looks interesting to learn what Heisig calls the "signal primitives" to aid in working out the pronounciation of a character, I found after such a long break from studying Japanese "proper" I didn't want to learn anything else out of context. I figured learning words was a better bet anyway (since my vocabulary is weak). What I'm finding is when I see word that uses a character used in words I already know I can make a fairly good guess at how to pronounce it now. The general feeling I get from those who've gone through RTK1 is that you can skip RTK2 without any problems.

I believe the second half of RTK3 teaches the readings of the new characters in a similar fashion to RTK2.
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Akalabeth
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Message 5 of 11

08 July 2010 at 3:45pm | IP Logged

If you did want to use RTK3, I would only use it for the keyword:character pairs
themselves, while ignoring the readings. I'm not going to start RTK3 for a while, but
when I do that's what I plan on. I'm also learning the readings of characters from
context, and it really has been effective for me. Once you've seen three words with 気
where it's pronounced 'ki' you tend to remember. It seems a lot easier to learn
meaning:pronunciation and meaning:spelling. Spelling:pronunciation comes on its own in
my experience.

If you wanted to start learning Japanese proper before finishing RTK1 you could still
learn meaning:pronunciation, since there's plenty of free audio resources available. I
didn't know about these until I had already finished RTK1, but Core 2000
(http://smart.fm/series/3318) and Core 6000 (http://smart.fm/series/3321) have an
English word and Japanese audio (as well as text) that you could study from.
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kidshomestunner
Senior Member
United Kingdom
Joined 6201 days ago
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Speaks: Japanese

Message 6 of 11

09 July 2010 at 1:57am | IP Logged

patuco wrote:

theallstar wrote:

I might even go through RTK3 at some point

kidshomestunner wrote:

TixhiiDon wrote:

I have read widely about RTK on this site, and since I haven't actually used it myself
I suppose I'm not really qualified to comment, but from what I've read, RTK really
seems like a massive exercise in futility. If I am correct, you learn keywords for
each of around 2000 kanji. So I guess this means you know that 木 means tree, right?
But surely this results in an enormous amount of expended time and effort, at the end
of which you have no idea that the kanji compound 木曜日 means "Thursday", doesn't have
anything to do with trees, and is read "mokuyoubi".

It would seem to me that, having finished RTK, you then have to start right back at the
beginning and actually learn how to read Japanese more or less from scratch.

Huge apologies if I've got it all wrong, but this is the impression I get from the
numerous posts about RTK on this site.

As usually Tixhiidon has it entirely right. Here is the entry for tree:

Remebering the kanji by James Heisig wrote:

Here we see a pictograph of a tree, showing the main trunk in
the long vertical stroke and the boughs in the long horizontal
stroke. The ³nal two strokes sweep down in both directions to
indicate the roots. Although it may look similar at ³rst sight to
the kanji for water (frame 130), the order in which it is written
is completely different and this affects its ³nal appearance. [4]
* As a primitive, this kanji can be used to mean tree or wood. In
those cases where the last two strokes are detached from the
trunk (6), we shall change its meaning to pole, or wooden
pole.

A Japanese person who taught me at "uni" can vouch that I know 2000 kanji: I will dig up my notes and give you some advice.

Use as many different methods and books as possible.

Don't just use one book.
Go to the library, get as many books as you can out.

Learn simple characters like one, two, three first as they look like what they represent.

Imagine squares turning into circles as explained in the book kanji wa musukasikunai

Study radicals. Radicals give clues to meaning and readings. Henshall outlines this in his book

Use linkword.

Use Vee David's Method Kanji Hybrid Method.

Your 学earning 進rogress will 決ecide the book’s 想oncept and 命estiny. In the 間eantime, I have 既lready
発eveloped a beta 版ersion of a KanjiHybrid software, that 自utomatically 変ransform　英nglish words into KanjiHybrids. Please 受ccept my 永ver-lasting 謝ratitude.

If we can 通ommunicate in KanjiHybrid 文ext such as 上bove, the 限imit is just one’s 創magination.

From my 窓indows by the 海cean,
Use Henshall's book(s)

Use James heisig's book as well as these methods
Don't just study the jouyou kanji.

Be an Alcoholic not a binge drinker: Study once every day for an hour, don't spend ten hours one day and no hours for the next five days.

I did have some more notes I will try and dig them out...

I do think RTK is seriously over rated though... Especially on this forum.

Edited by patuco on 09 July 2010 at 6:41pm
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Cyborg Ninja
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United States
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Speaks: English*
Studies: Japanese, Mandarin

Message 7 of 11

09 July 2010 at 4:36am | IP Logged

I've been studying Japanese for ten years so I'd like to know if there's any point in studying Heisig at an intermediate level. I find that studying radicals and their meanings is helpful.
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kidshomestunner
Senior Member
United Kingdom
Joined 6201 days ago
239 posts - 285 votes

Speaks: Japanese

Message 8 of 11

09 July 2010 at 6:16am | IP Logged

Cyborg Ninja wrote:

I'd like to know if there's any point in studying Heisig at an intermediate level.

I have done a fair bit with my short life and none of it has been "pointless". I just think that there are better books. I guess if you are motivated enough the method is not that important.

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