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Learning japanese in japan | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Advice Center |  | |
| Tyr Senior Member Sweden Joined 5593 days ago 316 posts - 384 votes  Speaks: English* Studies: Swedish | Message 1 of 18 21 March 2012 at 10:55am | IP Logged | ||
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I'm in Japan at the moment, working in a majority Japanese office and trying to learn the language.
It is not going well. I'm using anki practically every day, going through text books for grammar, etc.... but....I'm just not reaching critical mass. I understand more now than when I first came several months ago but it still isn't enough for even the simplest of conversations. Whats worse is my language skills are so up and down...once or twice I've managed to really get some good communication going with my limited vocabulary. Other times...I can't even understand what is your name. I'm told watching Japanese TV would help but I don't see how. Its just TV I don't understand. Nothing learned. Talking to people...can't really be done as I'm not at the level where a basic conversation can be had to be improved upon. I can read a lot more than I can speak. Kanji really makes that side of things simpler...but makes it harder to expand that knowledge into speaking. So...any general advice on what I can be trying to do to learn a language in country? When I was in Sweden I had the advantage of classes and it being so similar to English. In Japan there is none of that. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Ibryam000 Diglot Newbie France Joined 4476 days ago 37 posts - 50 votes Speaks: French*, English Studies: Bulgarian, Spanish | Message 2 of 18 21 March 2012 at 11:34am | IP Logged | ||
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Since you use Anki every day, you probably know more words than you think in what is said to you. That's why people tell you to watch TV, to be exposed to the language in order to distinguish words within sentences.
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| Odysseus Diglot Newbie United States Joined 4802 days ago 19 posts - 28 votes Speaks: English*, Korean Studies: Mandarin | Message 3 of 18 21 March 2012 at 11:50am | IP Logged | ||
My initial experiences learning Korean in Korea were similar; it took me quite a long time to even be basically conversant, and my reading level was always and still is much higher than my speaking level. Languages like Japanese and Korean simply take a long time to get a solid grip on for native English speakers. Don't fret too much. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Kappa Groupie Japan Joined 5331 days ago 99 posts - 172 votes | Message 4 of 18 21 March 2012 at 12:28pm | IP Logged | ||
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I don't find watching TV to be much helpful, either. It might be just I don't see how it's helping me but I don't feel any improvement even after more than a thousand hours of it (mostly TV series). However, it can be a good motivator to watch something that you enjoy in the target language and you might occasionally pick up some things (words, phrases, etc.). For me, it feels good to be able to make out even tiny bits of what's going on here and there and it gets even better with my comprehension in my target language improves.
I don't have any advice per se (I'll leave that to experienced learners, I'm not in any place to give advice on learning languages) but I think attitude matters. You sound a little discouraged and frustrated. It may not be easy when you are frustrated like that but you should be instead excited that you're in the country, that you have this great opportunity. Many people would kill to have such opportunities. Well, you could try to describe things you see, things that interest you, whatever they are, in Japanese (As I'm the type to neglect oral/active skills, I haven't done it myself but there are people who adovocate things like that, Arekkusu being one.) But the best thing about being in the country where your target language is spoken is, I think, that you can completely immerse yourself. You can easily find Japanese speakers! Find someone who is patient and glad to help you along the way. It's not hard to find language exchange partners since you speak English. Swedish is not as popular but there should be people learning it, too. And most importantly, have fun! Best of luck, Kappa Edited by Kappa on 21 March 2012 at 12:30pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Hampie Diglot Senior Member Sweden Joined 6470 days ago 625 posts - 1009 votes Speaks: Swedish*, English Studies: Latin, German, Mandarin | Message 5 of 18 21 March 2012 at 12:54pm | IP Logged | ||
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Listen more to the dialogues. If you're through Genki, put the dialogues, put them on your phone/ipod and listen
to them, speak along, play one of the roles, etc. etc. Find a tutor? If you can afford it, someone who can talk to you and help you with whatever mistakes you make (and also explain things for you in English when necessary?) Costy, but might be worth it! 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Arekkusu Hexaglot Senior Member Canada bit.ly/qc_10_lec Joined 5192 days ago 3971 posts - 7747 votes Speaks: English, French*, GermanC1, Spanish, Japanese, Esperanto Studies: Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Estonian | Message 6 of 18 21 March 2012 at 4:33pm | IP Logged | ||
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You are really lucky to find yourself in a situation where live interactions with speakers is possible everyday, if not all the time, and you must take advantage of that. In no way does that compare to a passive source like TV. Anki is no match either: if you are in an environment where you are constantly exposed to Japanese, you will be exposed to all important words often enough that you will easily absorb them (if you are mentally available).
You are also in an ideal situation for the self-talk exercise that Kappa referenced -- think ahead, prepare what you going to say and anticipate what you might be told. Some advice: 1) focus on spoken language and communication, not academic material 2) stay away from English-speaking expats and make Japanese friends (this has got to be the single most important advice you could follow) 3) if you have Japanese friends who like to use English, limit how much English they can use, or designate days or time-frames that are Japanese only (so this remains fair for all) 4) aim to be Japanese, do what they do, talk the way they do 5) use every opportunity to reuse what you learned even if you aren't sure - it's normal to get it wrong at first 6)find a language partner or several of them and meet them on a regular basis; use this controled environment to do things that are harder than what you can already do and spend more time with the ones who push you the most. 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Tyr Senior Member Sweden Joined 5593 days ago 316 posts - 384 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Swedish | Message 7 of 18 22 March 2012 at 2:44am | IP Logged | ||
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Well...I want to learn Japanese anyway, have on and off tried it for years. But number 2 there is a big reason I want to do it. Its a bit of a catch 22- I can't make Japanese friends because I don't speak Japanese and I don't speak Japanese because I can't practice with Japanese people.
I do have one or two Japanese friends but they don't live near me and we all have full time jobs so whenever I do see them (literally just once or twice a month) we're too busy catching up and being friends for me to bother them for Japanese lessons. I know them since they used to live abroad so they're all fluent in English and know me purely through that. Avoiding expats....hmmm.... it sure makes sense to try and totally immerse from a language learning POV but there are some problems there. 1: I don't want to be THAT GUY. There are many examples of people who go totally native and absolutely shun contact with foreigners. Such behaviour....such people.....its just not good. 2: I work in a mainly Japanese office. I however work in a department which deals with the outside world and as such several of my immediate co-workers are also foreign. Even the Japanese I work with are fluent in English and that is the language we mainly work in. They'll speak amongst themselves in Japanese but when it comes to me...rather than stammer along with my 片言日本語 discussing what colour shirt they're wearing and other simplistic stuff they just use English. 3: Life is in English. The only places I can find to go out also attract manly foreigners, the Japanese just tend not to do bars or football clubs. Heaven knows I've tried to find a nice local pub frequented just by the locals but the foreigner places and snack bars (places where you pay £10+ just for sitting down because the server is a formerly attractive middle aged woman) are all there is in my town, I'm in a small city, not Tokyo. Learning Japanese is very important to me but I don't want to sacrifice all normal existence to do so. Thanks for the advice though! I will investigate the various suggestions. Edited by Tyr on 22 March 2012 at 2:52am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Arekkusu Hexaglot Senior Member Canada bit.ly/qc_10_lec Joined 5192 days ago 3971 posts - 7747 votes Speaks: English, French*, GermanC1, Spanish, Japanese, Esperanto Studies: Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Estonian | Message 8 of 18 22 March 2012 at 4:58am | IP Logged | ||
Tell me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like you're coming up with a lot of excuses. At some point, you'll have to decide whether you want to keep the lifestyle or learn the language. 4 persons have voted this message useful |
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