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A dead honest language CV... | ||
Tags: Curriculum Vitae (CV) | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : General discussion |  | |
| Solfrid Cristin Heptaglot Winner TAC 2011 & 2012 Senior Member Norway Joined 5124 days ago 4143 posts - 8864 votes  Speaks: Norwegian*, Spanish, Swedish, French, English, German, Italian Studies: Russian | Message 73 of 104 05 November 2013 at 12:49pm | IP Logged | |||||
Hey, You never know when that may come in handy. My sister once got a job because she had done a 2 day course in marine biology in France. The job she got was as a language teacher, and she and her closest competitor had the same education and the same grades. The philosphy of the employer was that she obviously thought outside the box, and had more varied interests. And who knows, your employer may be an ABBA fan :-) 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| s_allard Triglot Senior Member Canada Joined 5220 days ago 2704 posts - 5425 votes Speaks: French*, English, Spanish Studies: Polish | Message 74 of 104 05 November 2013 at 4:17pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Since we are talking about CV's, I think it is becoming more and more important to specifiy language certifications
just as one specifies diplomas and other credentials In my opinion, an effect of implementation of the CEFR is the standardization of proficiency definitions and the increasing importance of having passed the required tests. I'm seeing this everywhere, even here in Canada. Universities and colleges, of course, have been demanding language test results of foreign students for many years. But now for immigration, acquiring citizenship, entering certain professions and many jobs, a certified language test score is required. You can no longer get by with, "I think I'm at ..." You now have to show proof of actual test results. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| beano Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4412 days ago 1049 posts - 2152 votes Speaks: English*, German Studies: Russian, Serbian, Hungarian | Message 75 of 104 05 November 2013 at 4:26pm | IP Logged | |||||
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Test results fail to take account of one important factor; language ability deteriorates fairly rapidly if you do not expose yourself to the language. Passing a C1 Italian exam 10 years ago when you were living and working in Italy doesn't have the same clout today if you have lost contact with the language. Also a test is just a snapshot at one point in time, something you can prepare yourself for by targetting the material you know is likely to appear.
Sure, official certification is a useful benchmark, but no more than that. 8 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| s_allard Triglot Senior Member Canada Joined 5220 days ago 2704 posts - 5425 votes Speaks: French*, English, Spanish Studies: Polish | Message 76 of 104 05 November 2013 at 4:38pm | IP Logged | |||||
This very true. If I recall correctly certain test results may be valid for only a fixed number of years. And the same could be said of the university degree that you got 20 years ago. But the point that I wanted to get across is that in today's world actual language certfications are becoming more and more necessary. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
 Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6493 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 77 of 104 05 November 2013 at 4:40pm | IP Logged | |||||
In that case you will of course have to take take the required test, whether you like it or not. But normally only in one language, not in three or four, so most polyglots don't have to get those certificates. The exception would be people like Iwwersetzerin, who have managed to make a living out of being polyglots. By the way I have had my present job as an IT consultant or specialist or whatever in public service since 1986 (I'm not even sure of my title), and I have never had any certificate of any kind, except my exam from the university in French and literature and proof of participation in a few courses in specific computer programs along the way. I have just done my job, and there has been more than enough to do. But time is running out for people like me - everything has to be documented today, except the relevance of the demands for documentation. Edited by Iversen on 05 November 2013 at 4:49pm 4 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| s_allard Triglot Senior Member Canada Joined 5220 days ago 2704 posts - 5425 votes Speaks: French*, English, Spanish Studies: Polish | Message 78 of 104 05 November 2013 at 9:11pm | IP Logged | |||||
This well put. When I attended university I didn't have to write a language test to get in. Now I'm not sure that I would be able to get in. For better or for worse, the CEFR is part of this evolution towards standardization, certification and credentialization of human knowledge. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Julie Heptaglot Senior Member PolandRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 6693 days ago 1251 posts - 1733 votes 5 sounds Speaks: Polish*, EnglishB2, GermanC2, SpanishB2, Dutch, Swedish, French | Message 79 of 104 06 November 2013 at 2:50am | IP Logged | |||||
Interestingly enough, I have been observing an opposite trend for some time, at least in the professional context. The attitude of many companies seems to be as follows: "We don't really care about whatever language skills you claim to have in your CV. We don't care about your university diplomas. We don't even care about your CEFR certificates. If we really need you to use your language skills at work, we will test you anyway." Big international corporations organize their own standardized language tests or hire recruitment agencies to have the language level of applicants checked, among other things. Assessment centers, job interviews etc. are often run in the relevant language (usually English). Smaller companies stick at least to foreign-language job interviews. If the language knowledge is not checked, it is probably not as relevant as the job offer itself may suggest. My view on the situation might obviously be biased (based mostly on Polish examples of university graduates in their twenties or early thirties). However, I could safely say nobody ever seemed to care about my language diplomas (or the lack of thereof, depending on the language). They did care about my skills. 5 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
 emk Diglot Moderator United States Joined 5322 days ago 2615 posts - 8806 votes Speaks: English*, FrenchB2 Studies: Spanish, Ancient Egyptian Personal Language Map | Message 80 of 104 06 November 2013 at 3:14am | IP Logged | |||||
I work in the US technology industry, with lots of non-native speakers. Unless you're applying to work at some international mega-corporation, nobody cares whether you've ever taken an English proficiency exam. In fact, the people making the hiring decisions have probably never even heard of the TOEFL, etc., and wouldn't know how to interpret the scores if you included them. What they do care about is the job interview. Are you able to keep up, to understand the questions, and to give intelligent responses? Is your resume reasonably mistake-free? If so, you're good. Khatzumoto observed a similar situation in Japan:
The same companies which have a standardized procedure for evaluating language skills probably have tons of other bureaucratic overhead, too. If you don't like paperwork, find a smaller organization that hasn't standardized every last detail of your life, and which still trusts its employees to have common sense. Edited by emk on 06 November 2013 at 3:17am 2 persons have voted this message useful |
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