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Mitch’s Spanish log (TAC 2015) | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| Crush Tetraglot Senior Member ChinaRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5653 days ago 1622 posts - 2299 votes  Speaks: English*, Spanish, Mandarin, Esperanto Studies: Basque | Message 17 of 28 10 December 2014 at 9:40am | IP Logged | ||
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When i did Platiquemos, i would go through the dialogs, look up difficult parts in the book, and then after that just use the audio. Sometimes i'd need to look up a word or two from the drills after my first repetition, but after the first runthrough i just listened to the audio. I spent a lot of time going for walks, walking the dog, laying down in a park, etc. It was much less brutal walking around and being active.
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| mitcht Newbie Australia Joined 3529 days ago 32 posts - 36 votes Speaks: English* | Message 18 of 28 10 December 2014 at 8:33pm | IP Logged | ||
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I have been doing a similar thing crush but without the exercise. I only use the materials on the first run through
then go straight to the audio. With the FSI version, not sure about Platiquemos, the quality of the audio is such that it can be hard to understand some of the dialogue and even some of the drills. You do get the hang of it a bit but when new vocab is introduced it can be tricky. Just had an hour class via italki which went relatively well, the month or so of inactivity doesn't seem to have done too much damage. Going to do some book work now at the coffee shop and then some FSI with a walk this afternoon. Obviously not the best place to raise this question, but what are people's thoughts on the use of subtitles. Is watching with subtitles a good idea or are you just training yourself to rely on them? 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| iguanamon Pentaglot Senior Member Virgin Islands Speaks: Ladino Joined 5050 days ago 2237 posts - 6731 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, Portuguese, Haitian Creole, Creole (French) | Message 19 of 28 10 December 2014 at 11:02pm | IP Logged | ||
Yes and no, I will elaborate. In the beginning stages of learning how to listen, I think, in my experience, they are quite helpful if they are TL. I believe L1 subtitles are less useful as it generally leads to just reading English an tends to have an effect of focusing one's attention less on the TL. I never use English subs except for a parallel text that I can make myself. I want to be able to transition away from subs as quickly as possible as they can become a crutch. Fortunately for me, almost no Brazilian series are subtitled and there are no Ladino series, ditto for online Haitian Creole. How to wean one's self off of subs is highly individual. In Portuguese, I started listening to the NHK World (Español) Noticias because it had a transcript but that's a little different than TV since it's radio. I'd listen first while doing my morning walking. Then I'd come back home and listen and read the transcript. When I got good enough at listening, I didn't need the transcript anymore, but it takes daily listening to get used to it. When you can listen to a non-learning intended native "podcast" and consistently understand what you've heard, that's when you will have arrived. How long it takes depends on how long you work on it and how consistent you are- again, highly individual. That was just the beginning. Listening to a television series was another kettle of fish. My Brazilian (non-English-speaking) tutor had me start watching native series- none of which had subtitles available. Thus I was forced to pay attention. She expected me to note unknown words and phrases and write a summary of each episode and recite it. I'd have to watch an episode several times at first but after a couple of months, I got better, at the 2/3 mark of the 79 episode (40 minutes each) I was listening only once. I've written about it on the forum. If I were in your place, I'd find a dubbed American/British series that I knew in English and start watching in Spanish. I'd download the Spanish and English subtitle files and copy and paste them into a 2 column word document. I'd read that first. I'd watch the episode once without subs, then again with subs. I'd take notes while watching without subs and test myself with the subtitles. Obviously, this isn't for everyone. In this way the subtitles can be your check on your comprehension (assuming accuracy of subtitles to audio). If I had the computer chops to do it. I'd be doing subs2srs as a beginner and following emk's subs2srs log for advice. I do believe that series are better than movies for training listening because of the ability to get used to the actors' voices and repetition of situations. All this being said, do this however you want. You know yourself better than I or anyone else can. If you think subs are becoming a crutch, stop using them. What I did was very intensive, but it really helped me to turbocharge my listening. Edited by iguanamon on 10 December 2014 at 11:09pm 4 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| mitcht Newbie Australia Joined 3529 days ago 32 posts - 36 votes Speaks: English* | Message 20 of 28 11 December 2014 at 2:06am | IP Logged | ||
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Thanks a lot Iguanamon. I think they are probably useful for me at this stage as without them too much goes over
my head to make watching worthwhile. I'll give your advice a try. Cheers! 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| mitcht Newbie Australia Joined 3529 days ago 32 posts - 36 votes Speaks: English* | Message 21 of 28 20 December 2014 at 12:55am | IP Logged | ||
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Since the last post I have still been moving forwards with the study though perhaps not in the most efficient way. I
am back in Australia for a couple of weeks and as a result of spending time with friends, family, etc. am finding myself with less time. I haven't been very diligent in continuing with FSI though i do intend to keep it up. I have been working through my grammar books and have had some brief conversations in Spanish. I have purchased a kindle and started to work my way through el principito but am finding it a bit of a slog and my vocab is probably not where i thought it was at. I also purchased the hunger games which seems a little easier. I do need to schedule another skype lesson but because i am staying with family here and they don't really use the internet it may be difficult. Intending to sign up for the 2015 TAC now. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| mitcht Newbie Australia Joined 3529 days ago 32 posts - 36 votes Speaks: English* | Message 22 of 28 31 December 2014 at 7:16am | IP Logged | ||
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I am due an update but am just back in the US today after a couple of weeks home for Christmas. I'll do it as part of
my first TAC post. TAC 2015 Challenge starting from below. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| mitcht Newbie Australia Joined 3529 days ago 32 posts - 36 votes Speaks: English* | Message 23 of 28 19 March 2015 at 3:18am | IP Logged | ||
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I've been very slack with this log - I had the excuse of moving across the pacific to the US but that doesn't really
hold water anymore. I've now been settled in the north east for the past 2 months and have made some progress but less than i'd like. I have watched quite a lot of el internado but with English subtitles, i figured i was doing OK but when i couldn't find the seventh season with any subtitles it became apparent i used them more than i was thinking. I could still follow the plot enough and my girlfriend filled me in on anything significant i missed - often times getting the gist is not enough, the devil is in the details. I have started doing FSI again on my drive to and from work and times well to getting through 1 lesson each day (though i tend to do each twice). I'm also using a tutor again over the phone once a week which should hopefully start to pay off. I'm also thinking of heading to a local Spanish meet up or conversation class. What I am struggling with is how to best use my time - I would like to keep reading (the hunger games at the moment), working through practice makes perfect grammar books and listening to podcasts but i'm not sure what to prioritise. I think at the moment putting time into FSI and grammar would be most beneficial so will try and stick to that along with fitting in speaking whenever i can. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Crush Tetraglot Senior Member ChinaRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5653 days ago 1622 posts - 2299 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, Mandarin, Esperanto Studies: Basque | Message 24 of 28 20 March 2015 at 7:22am | IP Logged | ||
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My suggestion would be to stick FSI through to the end. It'll take you further than any of the other courses alone will and will get you actually speaking. You can use the PMP books later if you find there are still small holes in your grammar (i stopped studying grammar completely after finishing Platiquemos), but if you can dedicate a good hour or two to FSI every day, i think that will give you the most run for your money (or time).
I would also stick away from English subtitles if you can, Spanish subtitles will give you more practice and you'll focus exclusively on the Spanish. You'll eventually want to stop using them as a crutch for understanding and just focus on what you're hearing, but if you don't understand much without them i'd say use them. In my experience, watching with English subtitles is generally about as effective as watching with English audio. It's nice to see you stop by again, though! 2 persons have voted this message useful |
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