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Is Arabic underestimated?

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hp230
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Speaks: German, Arabic (classical)*, French, English

 
 Message 25 of 75
09 July 2015 at 6:51pm | IP Logged 
Luso wrote:


As for literature, maybe you're being a bit hard on yourself: Arab book prizes seem to
showcase vibrant minds. And some details are wonderful: just recently, a woman got an
award for a piece of work denouncing women's living conditions. The award was
delivered in a country not known for a progressive stand in favour of women's rights
(it was their turn to host the event, I guess), and in the end it all went very well.
:P
.

I've already said that there are exceptions. However, I still insist that the quality of the writings has dramatically dropped. There are no more famous names as it was 50 years ago (during and after the colonization period of the arabic world especially). Anyway, I may be wrong but that's my humble opinion. In fact, even the reading community is shrinking day after day. A recent study have shown that the average number of books a Tunisian reads per year is 2 pages!!!! my god!!!!. (This so embarrassing but it's the truth)
So, you can see why I'm being "hard on myself" :'(.

About the history thing, it's true that Mecca, Damaskas and then Baghdad were the centers of power of the Islamic picture, but we can not forget the role of north africa in spreading the religion and the language with it.

Ifriqiyya (north africa now) was the key to conquer the Iberian peninsula after all, and even after the fall of Baghdad, Ifriqiyya got its independance and in the period of 200 years many great things were established within the islamic culture. Even after it was conquered by the ottomon empire, the relationship was almost limited to paying taxes and designating governers.


Now if I may add something to the Tatars story, my piano teacher (who is Ukrainien) once told me that the center power of the Russkievska empire have changed from Kiev to Moskou (which was only a small village) due to the mongolo-tatar invasion, Imagine that didn't happen, many things would change obviously.
Adding some action to the picture, the fall of Baghdad was really really weird, just 20 days and everything was gone!!!
History is cruel, sometimes hutful to tell but always good to know.



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cod2
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48 posts - 69 votes 

 
 Message 26 of 75
09 July 2015 at 7:30pm | IP Logged 
I read all this chest-beating about Mongol invasion of Arab land with bewilderment.

I take it none of you have heard of what Muslim invaders did to India and Hindus for hundreds of years before the British rescued India from the certainty of becoming yet another Muslim country? No? The wanton slaughter, rapes, the slave-taking, the pillage, the temple-desecration, the forced conversion,... Not heard about those either?

The Mongol invasion gave the Arabs perhaps a small taste of what they did to hundreds of other countries - far away from their own land.

Let's stick to discussing languages, shall we?

Edited by cod2 on 09 July 2015 at 7:44pm

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Chung
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Speaks: English*, French
Studies: Polish, Slovak, Uzbek, Turkish, Korean, Finnish

 
 Message 27 of 75
09 July 2015 at 7:50pm | IP Logged 
cod2 wrote:
I read all this chest-beating about Mongol invasion of Arab land with bewilderment.


Why? We were trying to flesh out how a language with such a long recorded history, and association with a powerful and wide-ranging civilization is arguably less popular than Japanese or Korean, among other "smaller" languages.

cod2 wrote:
I take it none of you have heard of what Muslim invaders did to India and Hindus for hundreds of years before the British rescued India from the certainty of becoming yet another Muslim country? No? The wanton slaughter, rapes, the slave-taking, the pillage, the temple-desecration, the forced conversion,... Not heard about those either?

The Mongol invasion gave the Arabs perhaps a small taste of what they did to hundreds of other countries - far away from their own land.


That's nice, but how does that relate to the blow to Arabic's prestige?

cod2 wrote:
Let's stick to discussing languages, shall we?


Indeed.
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ScottScheule
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scheule.blogspot.com
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 Message 28 of 75
09 July 2015 at 8:22pm | IP Logged 
As Chung says. Cod2's comment seems best ignored as irrelevant to the thread topic.
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cod2
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 Message 29 of 75
09 July 2015 at 8:30pm | IP Logged 
ScottScheule wrote:
As Chung says. Cod2's comment seems best ignored as irrelevant to the thread topic.


Whereas these lines below allegedly are very relevant to the thread.

kanewai wrote:

1200's - The Mongol invasions. Entire kingdoms are reduced to dust from China to
Arabia. Baghdad is sacked, and it's libraries, mosques, and schools burned. The city
lies in ruin for centuries.


Serpent wrote:

I'm so angry that I was never taught about the Mongol invasions of the Muslim countries ...


Chung wrote:

I think that the point is that the Mongol occupation was remarkable for its destructiveness...


Luso wrote:

The Mongol invasions were the worst thing that befell the Islamic world, hands down.
...
It has been said that, after the conquest of Baghdad, the Tigris river ran red(the blood) and then black (the ink from the books of the many libraries thrown away)for days.
...
Of course, the Crusades were one large, unmitigated crime against humanity, unleashed
to quench an European Christian problem,


Like I said, stick to languages. If you want to discuss history and politics, then perhaps you should have less delicate sensibilities.

Edited by cod2 on 09 July 2015 at 9:26pm

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kanewai
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 Message 30 of 75
09 July 2015 at 9:32pm | IP Logged 
On paper Arabic should be a world language. The only way to understand why it
isn't is to look into history, culture, and current events.

Like I said, stick to languages. If you want to discuss history and politics, sure,
but then don't have such delicate sensibilities.


It seems like it's been a polite and interesting thread so far. I'm seeing different
viewpoints, which is great; I'm not seeing any 'delicate sensibilities.'
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ScottScheule
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scheule.blogspot.com
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645 posts - 1176 votes 
Speaks: English*, Spanish
Studies: Latin, Hungarian, Biblical Hebrew, Old English, Russian, Swedish, German, Italian, French

 
 Message 31 of 75
09 July 2015 at 9:37pm | IP Logged 
Cod2, all those comments are relevant to the topic of why Arabic is unpopular. Yours was not. Your comment was an attempt to claim some kind of parity between Mongol invasions and Muslim conquests, which, hell, may even be true--but that doesn't make it relevant. If you have something to say about why Arabic is not as popular as some think it should be, feel free to say so.

Please note, I don't object to discussing history and politics. In a thread on language popularity, those are big factors that need to be discussed. I object to your comment's relevancy--not its subject matter.

Edited by ScottScheule on 09 July 2015 at 9:39pm

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cod2
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 Message 32 of 75
09 July 2015 at 9:43pm | IP Logged 
ScottScheule wrote:
Cod2, all those comments are relevant to the topic of why Arabic is unpopular.


No, they are not, and they don't become so just because you claim so. To me they are emotive chest-beating that shows a certain political agenda which has no place in a language board.


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