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TAC 2013 Team Sparta’s Greek Team Thread | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| embici Triglot Senior Member CanadaRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 4608 days ago 263 posts - 370 votes  Speaks: English*, Spanish, French Studies: Greek | Message 161 of 231 12 January 2013 at 4:06pm | IP Logged | ||
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Καλό Σαββατοκύριακο σε όλους.
Μπράβο for your excellent intro, stelingo. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Ogrim Heptaglot Senior Member France Joined 4637 days ago 991 posts - 1896 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, English, Spanish, French, Romansh, German, Italian Studies: Russian, Catalan, Latin, Greek, Romanian | Message 162 of 231 16 January 2013 at 3:11pm | IP Logged | ||
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embici and stelingo, good job on your introductions. I managed to get some meaning out of it (I think), but it will be a while before I can do the same.
I also have a couple of questions, probably for renessaincemedi: I have managed to do a couple of lessons more in Assimil, and there are always some questions that remain unanswered (this is one of the things I do not like about this course, the explanations are not really covering everything). First question: In lesson six they introduce plural of nouns, and they give the following sentences: Ο άνθροπος είναι εδώ, τον βλέπω. Βλέπω τον άνθροπο. Οι άνθροποι είναι εδώ, τους βλέπω.Βλέπω τους ανθρόπους. So apparently the accent changes place in the accusative plural of a masculine noun. However, this does not seem to happen in the other examples (which are in feminine and neuter). Is there a general rule or does it have to do with the fact that in nominative, the accent is on the ante-penultimate syllable? Second question: In a sentence in the same lesson they use the word κγαρσόν(ι). I really have two questions to this. Fristly, why the parenthesis, is it optional whether to pronounce the last vowel? Secondly, do you really use this word in Greek for waiter? Obviously it comes from French "garçon", but here in France I never hear this word used nowadays. People talk about "serviteurs" and "servitrices", and if you call for them, you will say Monsieur or Madame. I believe many waiters would think you were rude and condescending if you called them "garçon". Finally a general question related to this thread. I was not sure whether to post the above here or in my log, so I want to know what the view of the Team leader and other members is. Is it useful if we put questions like these in the Team blog, or should we rather use our personal logs for that? Edited by Ogrim on 16 January 2013 at 3:13pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| renaissancemedi Bilingual Triglot Senior Member Greece Joined 4356 days ago 941 posts - 1309 votes Speaks: Greek*, Ancient Greek*, EnglishC2 Studies: French, Russian, Turkish, Modern Hebrew | Message 163 of 231 16 January 2013 at 3:32pm | IP Logged | ||
Ο άνθρωπος είναι εδώ, τον βλέπω. Βλέπω τον άνθρωπο. Οι άνθρωποι είναι εδώ, τους βλέπω.Βλέπω τους ανθρώπους. The stress position has to do with the last syllable. There is this rule Όταν η λήγουσα είναι μακρά, η προπαραλήγουσα δεν τονίζεται. That is: when the last syllable is long, the third syllable from last (ante-penultimate ? ) does not take a stress. The diphthong ου is long. So the stress goes to the next syllable. You should find the rules for when vowels/diphthongs are long or short. Some are fixed, some can be both according to their position. I know it sounds confusing, but is just grammar. Or you can just learn the assimil lessons without asking too much, but I can tell you I am glad you asked. Yes, we do use that word, mainly for men waiters. It is not insulting but it is not very classy. Better raise your hand a bit to get the waiter's attention, and say: check please! or: here please! Oh, the last -ι is a dreadfull addition of a greek ending syllable to a french word. I never use it. 4 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Ogrim Heptaglot Senior Member France Joined 4637 days ago 991 posts - 1896 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, English, Spanish, French, Romansh, German, Italian Studies: Russian, Catalan, Latin, Greek, Romanian | Message 164 of 231 16 January 2013 at 3:40pm | IP Logged | ||
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Thanks for the explanation rennaissancemedi. I am a curious person who likes to ask the question "why?", so I am afraid I won't be able to just do assimil without asking.
I just ordered the book "Greek, an Essential Grammar" and look forward to receiving it so I can try to find answers there as well. I'll avoid the garçon word in Greek as well then, thanks. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| renaissancemedi Bilingual Triglot Senior Member Greece Joined 4356 days ago 941 posts - 1309 votes Speaks: Greek*, Ancient Greek*, EnglishC2 Studies: French, Russian, Turkish, Modern Hebrew | Message 165 of 231 16 January 2013 at 3:47pm | IP Logged | ||
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I don't know that book, but good luck with your struggle with grammar. Just so you feel better should you find it difficult in the future, there are Greeks who make those mistakes, who have to (or should!) open a grammar book from time to time. There is also the occasional argument on grammar issues. I am happy to answer questions: it makes me remember grammar rules as well :)
Edited by renaissancemedi on 16 January 2013 at 4:04pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| stelingo Hexaglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 5830 days ago 722 posts - 1076 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, Portuguese, French, German, Italian Studies: Russian, Czech, Polish, Greek, Mandarin | Message 166 of 231 16 January 2013 at 7:03pm | IP Logged | ||
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I didn't know the rule about long vowels and not stressing the antepenultimate syllable. Very useful. Thanks rennaissancemedi.
Btw waiter/waitress in Fremch is serveur/serveuse is it not? Edited by stelingo on 16 January 2013 at 7:04pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| LanguageSponge Triglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 5764 days ago 1197 posts - 1487 votes Speaks: English*, German, French Studies: Welsh, Russian, Japanese, Slovenian, Greek, Italian | Message 167 of 231 17 January 2013 at 2:16am | IP Logged | ||
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Hi everyone,
Ogrim, I think it'd be really good for you to post those sorts of questions on the Team Thread, to keep it active, and I think it's great to have general grammatical issues like this discussed out in the open. I will be back more often after my birthday on Sunday. I'm still trying to get used to an increased work schedule and a family problem. Good luck with the grammar issue. I don't know what it is but wrong stress is one of the things that really irks me for some reason, in any language. Jack 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Ogrim Heptaglot Senior Member France Joined 4637 days ago 991 posts - 1896 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, English, Spanish, French, Romansh, German, Italian Studies: Russian, Catalan, Latin, Greek, Romanian | Message 168 of 231 17 January 2013 at 8:46am | IP Logged | ||
You are absolutely right, it should be serveur. The word serviteur exists as well, but means "servant". Don't know what happened there, some sort of Freudian slip maybe. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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