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Hello Everyone & 15 Languages Intro | ||
Tags: United States | Introduction | ||
 Language Learning Forum : Members profiles |  | |
| Crush Tetraglot Senior Member ChinaRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5866 days ago 1622 posts - 2299 votes  Speaks: English*, Spanish, Mandarin, Esperanto Studies: Basque | Message 33 of 41 20 February 2014 at 3:36am | IP Logged |
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You mention "Castilian" Spanish and "Latin American" Spanish, but as with most languages there are a wide variety of dialects both in Spain and in Latin American. It doesn't affect your ability to communicate that much, but on a colloquial level there might be some misunderstandings, especially in areas where indigenous languages are commonly spoken. In Portuguese the same thing happens. Think about the US, someone from Louisiana doesn't generally speak the same way someone from Oregon or Indiana or New Jersey speaks. At some point you'll have to realize that you won't be able to speak like every person who speaks that language does, but that doesn't mean you won't be able to communicate with them. My Spanish, for example, is a messy mixture of different Spanish dialects i've picked up over the years.
Good luck, anyway. Have you started studying yet? 4 persons have voted this message useful | |
| FashionPolyglot Newbie United StatesRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 3944 days ago 39 posts - 73 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Portuguese | Message 34 of 41 20 February 2014 at 4:10am | IP Logged |
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@Crush
Thank you for letting me know about the variety of Spanish dialects. And to answer your question, yes. I've started studying, but I only know a few Brazilian Portuguese words so far. I've only tried Language Pod 101 so far, but plan on using other resources. Good luck to you too on your language studies! :) 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| iguanamon Pentaglot Senior Member Virgin Islands Speaks: Ladino Joined 5263 days ago 2241 posts - 6731 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, Portuguese, Haitian Creole, Creole (French) | Message 35 of 41 20 February 2014 at 4:14am | IP Logged |
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FashionPolyglot, you don't have to tell me about the differences between Brazilian and Iberian Portuguese. I just got back from a visit to Portugal in January, where I happened to speak Brazilian Portuguese the whole time with no problems in being understood/understanding at all. No one was offended by my Brazilian accent/patterns. The Lisboenses were just grateful I could speak Portuguese of any kind. I also spoke with Angolans, Cape Verdeans, Guineans, Mozambicans and Goans at length with no problems.
Since you have expressed an interest in learning Brazilian Portuguese, I will take the time to share with you my advice on learning Portuguese. First read my post about the multi-track approach. Also, check out leosmith's listening from the beginning. These threads will give you a good introduction to my approach to language-learning and shed light on my recommendations. Bear in mind that others differ in their approaches. Caveat: I already spoke Spanish, which was a huge help. I didn't have to start out from scratch. If I were you, I'd begin with the DLI (Defense Language Institute) Portuguese Basic Course. When you click the link, you'll find "Basic Books" and "Portuguese MP3". Download all those files. If you use firefox, download them with a download manager like "down them all". The "Portuguese Head Start" is a phrasebook with audio for visitors to Portugal. Next I'd listen to Brazilian Music as much as possible. Lyrics can be found by typing "song title + letra". I'd also recommend you get a copy of Pimsleur's Brazilian Portuguese course from your library and use it in tandem with the free DLI course. If your local library doesn't have it, speak to the librarian and ask for an "inter-library loan". Burn the cd's to mp3. Using the two courses simultaneously (one in the morning, the other in the afternoon, for example) gives good synergy. Next, try to listen to natural Brazilian Portuguese as often as you can. In addition to Pimsleur, I used the NHK World Portuguese Newscast in Brazilian Portuguese for listening training. The audio is downloadable to mp3 and the transcript is exact. The English versions of the stories can be found by navigating to the NHK English site- click English on the drop-down list. If you know the story in English, you can make the Portuguese comprehensible. I'm going to give you some other great sites with listening and reading available but they're in Iberian and African Portuguese even though you've decided that the two don't mix with Brazil. They helped me a lot to learn the language and understand both varieties. First there's the radionovelas from Deutsche Welle's "Learning By Ear". Each radionovela has about 10 episodes of about 10 minutes length. The audio is downloadable in mp3 and the transcript is in pdf format. I'd start with Fábulas Africanas. The advantage is that the language is intended for young people, the audio and transcripts are free and the language is conversational. The English for making your own bilingual texts is available at DW's English LBE site African Fables. The DW LBE Portuguese home page has over 90 hours of audio with transcripts available. Even though you may not need the radionovelas now, download them anyway because they will be gone by the end of the year. DW is ending their Portuguese service. Next, start a log. (Have a look at kujichagulia's log. He started Portuguese from scratch.) Having a log allows you to get advice and help along the way and is a commitment that can help to keep you consistent and persistent. All the resources I provided are free. The DLI course is old but the audio is listenable and the pdf's are readable- better if you can ocr them. The DLI course is very thorough and covers all aspects. That being said, NO COURSE will teach you the (or any) language by itself. The drills were especially useful to me. Knowing Spanish meant that I dropped in at volume 4. I also spoke at every opportunity and hired a private tutor. I watched/watch Brazilian TV and movies. I listened to and enjoyed Brazilian music. Don't just do courses. If you are consistent and persistent, if you approach language-learning with humility above all things, you will be successful. Boa sorte com seus estudos! Edited by iguanamon on 20 February 2014 at 4:27am 5 persons have voted this message useful | |
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6598 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 36 of 41 20 February 2014 at 7:56am | IP Logged |
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You may want to read more of Iversen's posts. He travels a lot and explores his interests through his languages, both while travelling and at home.
And the differences you listed are so basic that any learner of Portuguese should know them. Also, misunderstandings happen even between very close people who have the same native language and live under the same roof. The way to minimize them is not to attempt to learn every possible dialect, but to get used to every speaker you meet. 4 persons have voted this message useful | |
| FashionPolyglot Newbie United StatesRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 3944 days ago 39 posts - 73 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Portuguese | Message 37 of 41 20 February 2014 at 4:04pm | IP Logged |
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@Serpent
I don't really follow Iversen's posts or Youtube videos, so I just assumed that he doesn't travel. Though I am subscribed to his channel on Youtube. I sometimes misunderstand about what my family is trying to say, and I'm use to it. That happens to everyone. If I can adjust with my native tongue, I sure can adjust with Portuguese speakers who don't speak the Brazilian dialect. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| FashionPolyglot Newbie United StatesRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 3944 days ago 39 posts - 73 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Portuguese | Message 38 of 41 20 February 2014 at 4:46pm | IP Logged |
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@Igauanamon
Obrigado! I just have a few questions to ask: How was your trip to Portugal, Brazil, and African Portuguese speaking countries? How did you manage to avoid miscommunication? Are the people in Portuguese speaking countries nice & friendly? What are some Brazilian & Portuguese manners? Did you have any bad experiences while traveling to Portuguese speaking countries? What great travel destinations/sightseeing locations is worth visiting? Do you plan to travel Macau, China and East Timor/Timor Leste? Music Recommendations? Movies & Television recommendations? Do you recommend watching & listening to Portuguese entertainment, even though I'm learning Brazilian Portuguese? The next couple questions are about Fashion. I will understand if you can't answer these. What kind of clothes do Brazilians wear? And the Portuguese? How seriously is Fashion looked at in Brazil & Portugal? Do the clothes they wear represent social status/social class? Have you met any models, or been to any fashion shows in either Brazil or Portugal? And if you haven't, I recommend going to see a fashion show in both countries the next time you visit. If your lucky enough, you might even meet a super model! I know people who go to fashion shows while traveling to different countries. Some of them even speak the language. Attending a fashion show adds joy to your travel experience, and trust me, you don't want to miss out! 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6598 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 39 of 41 20 February 2014 at 7:44pm | IP Logged |
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"Mercy!" cried Gandalf. "If the giving of knowledge is to be the cure of your inquisitiveness, I shall spend all the rest of my days in answering you. What more should you like to know?"
"The names of all the stars, and of all living things, and the whole history of Middle-Earth and Over-heave and of the Sundering Seas," laughed Pippin. "Of course! What less?" :) 4 persons have voted this message useful | |
| iguanamon Pentaglot Senior Member Virgin Islands Speaks: Ladino Joined 5263 days ago 2241 posts - 6731 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, Portuguese, Haitian Creole, Creole (French) | Message 40 of 41 20 February 2014 at 9:29pm | IP Logged |
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FashionPolyglot, while I appreciate your youthful enthusiasm, I don't have the time to answer all your questions.
I thoroughly enjoyed Portugal. I wrote about it here (scroll down) on the forum. I had no problems understanding and being understood. This was my second trip to Portugal but my first to Lisboa. I also visited Brasil for a month a couple of years ago and may go back again this summer or fall. People in Brazil and Portugal are very friendly indeed, same goes for the Lusophone Africans I met there as well. That being said, Brazilians are hands down the friendliest people on the planet, in my opinion. Brazilian TV and films are hard to obtain outside of Brazil but are available by searching. I just bought a 16 dvd set of the Mandrake HBO series from Amazon for $4 plus $4 shipping. Music, TV and film is down to personal taste. One good way to find what you like is to do a wikipedia search in English then go the left and click "Portuguese" for the same article in Portuguese (Wikipedia doesn't make a distinction between Iberian, African or Brazilian)- searches like "Brazilian Cinema", "Brazilian Music", "Brazilian Literature", "Brazilian TV", etc. When you study Brazilian Portuguese, concentrate on the Brazilian variety as much as possible but don't ignore the Iberian/African. You can achieve a balance, maybe 70/30 that won't mess up your pronunciation/grammar/constructions but will still allow you to become very familiar with the other accents. As has been said, it is not possible to learn every variation of a pluricentric language. I concentrate on Portuguese as spoken in Brazil but also listen regularly to Iberian and African varieties. As far as fashion goes, I'm not interested at all. "Clothes may make the man/woman" but I'm more interested in who people are than what they wear- hence why I learn their languages. Serpent used sarcasm to humorous effect to make a point about your exuberance. I don't want to kill your enthusiasm but you should try to curb it just a bit. It took me about half an hour to write my previous post- time I took in order to help you. Now's the time to start actually learning the language, stop talking about learning it and end this thread. Most of these introductory threads rarely go beyond a page. Yours is at five pages and still going. This thread is turning into your defacto log on the open forum and opening you up to unwanted criticism and sarcasm. You should start your own log. Update it regularly- not just with a "today I did lesson one of such and such, a half an hour of such and such and reviewed x" but flesh it out a bit with your understandings, successes and difficulties. People will be glad to give you a hand if you can win them over but don't expect a handout. Not that that's what you're doing but you really don't want to be too demanding of someone's time. Most of us genuinely enjoy helping those beginners who are trying to help themselves. You'll find when you start your log and show people that that's what you're trying to do- actually learning, there will be plenty of help available when you need it and ask for it. I will be there to help you, provided that I see that you are genuinely serious about learning Portuguese. So will the Brazilians and others who are learning or have learned the language. Looking forward to following your new log. Edited by iguanamon on 20 February 2014 at 10:03pm 6 persons have voted this message useful |
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