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Mandarin journey (FSI, Pimsleur, NPCR) | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| BertR Triglot Newbie United States Joined 5608 days ago 2 posts - 2 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, French Studies: Mandarin | Message 113 of 181 01 August 2009 at 12:01am | IP Logged | ||
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Hello,
Thanks for your explanation, now everything is pretty clear to me. Some time ago you mentioned that you were willing to share your Anki decks. Is this still the case? I would be really interesting in these (especially the ones with audio). Since I discovered that they had Pimsleur in our local library, I started listening to these recordings. Although I already know most of it, it is still interesting since I know a lot passively, and for example if I try to talk fast my tones aren't very good. I'm doing several lessons a day (since I already know most of it) and currently I'm listening to Manderin III, 5. I expect to finish this the end of next week, and then I'll start with FSI. I tried to post a log (with a lot of Chinese characters) in a personal log, but each time got an incomprehensible error message. In the end I gave up. In the meantime I started posting my progress on QQ. In case you are interested: http://user.qzone.qq.com/860376804 look at the 日志. Regards, Bert 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Snowflake Senior Member United States Joined 5951 days ago 1032 posts - 1233 votes  Studies: Mandarin | Message 114 of 181 15 August 2009 at 2:42am | IP Logged | ||
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Irrationale, now that you should be fully recovered from the jet lag, how was China? How did your Mandarin skills hold up to actually being in the country? Or did you end up in a enclave of Shanghainese speakers?
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| irrationale Tetraglot Senior Member China Joined 6042 days ago 669 posts - 1023 votes 2 sounds Speaks: English*, Spanish, Mandarin, Tagalog Studies: Ancient Greek, Japanese | Message 115 of 181 15 August 2009 at 8:13am | IP Logged | ||
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Hey, thanks for asking! I kind of forgot to update the log.
China was awesome, really awesome. I loved it. To talk about the actual trip is too long of a post, so I'll skip to the language aspect. Basically my situation was this; I could say what I wanted to (for the most part, I got into some surprise intellectual-type discussions which I choked), but had a lot of trouble understanding what people were answering. I understood perfectly perhaps 30 to 40% of the people I talked to. Some I couldn't understand at all. There are a couple of reasons for this besides the fact that listening to Chinese is hard; 1) Since I talk relatively fast, my speaking ability belies the strength of my listening skills. So they reply native speed. 2) I didn't ask for people to slow down or speak slowly, just to repeat and for me to pray to understand. Why? I don't know...it is just embarrassing to ask that, to me. Plus I don't think people like to or can slow down their speech. 3) Some of them were probably speaking Shanghainese or mixture to me without me even knowing it. A couple of random remarksl -I could NOT understand ANY taxi-driver, other than the most basic sentences. I assume it is because of the dialect. -There are more people in China than I ever thought that cannot curl their tongue, which is a huge wake-up call for us learners. I know WANT to listen to that horrible accent rather than avoid it. Every learner should listen to it. -I should have prepared a "what is your opinion of Obama" answer. This kind of question leads into the dangerzone for me, because I want to give a really detailed reply, but choke on unknown words and phrases. Next time that shouldn't be a problem. Another thing. I was warned about language bandits, or people harrasing me to speak English. I never met one. Not one. As soon as I opened my mouth and they heard I spoke Chinese, they responded in rapid Chinese, old and young. And I am not that amazing in Chinese, no "Dashan". It got the point were I was even going out of my way to try to get a Chinese person to try their English with me. Most people in China can NOT speak English. Young people can speak individual words, less can say a phrase. Those that can do it fluently I think are very few indeed. I only came across one college student that had studied in the west that had fluent English. Anyway, China definitely "set the bar" for what I need to attain. Listening ability is getting a huge focus with even more listening everyday, up to perhaps 3.5 hours (Chinese TV, talk radio, movies). I need to get to around the 8,000 word mark to start having real discussions and get technical and poetic (I know around 4,500 to 5,000 words). As of now I am just memorizing more words and reviewing, reading a book, going through textbooks and HSK prep materials that I got in China, and watching TV shows and movies. Of course also talking with friends in China in Chinese, this is critical for output. I try to watch Chinese shows, and American shows with Chinese caps. This "reverse" caption technique really works; it is definitely improving my vocab and overall understanding. Not a lot to report, but if something comes up I will. How are your studies going? Where are all the Mandarin learners on the forum anyway? Edited by irrationale on 15 August 2009 at 8:17am 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| bouda Senior Member United States Joined 5589 days ago 194 posts - 197 votes Speaks: English* | Message 116 of 181 15 August 2009 at 5:04pm | IP Logged | ||
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Sounds like you had a great time. I hope to visit China or Taiwan this winter and hope
that my experience will be as fun as yours was! What TV shows and movies in Chinese have you especially enjoyed? I never know what TV is good. I used to watch period dramas but I know nothing about the stuff set in the modern era. I'm also curious if you have had good experiences with popular novels. I do read a lot but most of the books I read are books I knew of already from English - books or authors that were famous or classic enough to enter the common Western consciousness: Ba Jin, Lao She... not always great for learning colloquial or contemporary vocabulary. ETA: I know I've definitely asked Snowflake this question about TV shows before but as I'm always on the look-out for new things, it doesn't hurt to ask you as well! There are a couple Mandarin learners on this forum - a search of the language logs should turn up quite a few - but it seems like there are mostly a lot of beginners (not a bad thing, just an observation). I keep my Chinese log off-site but like to read through whatever Mandarin threads pop up on my screen! Edited by bouda on 15 August 2009 at 5:17pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Snowflake Senior Member United States Joined 5951 days ago 1032 posts - 1233 votes Studies: Mandarin | Message 117 of 181 16 August 2009 at 1:04am | IP Logged | ||
Your trip to China sounds really encouraging!
I am still buried in work so not so great. My character studies are totally by the wayside. Reading texts is also pretty much by the wayside. My one constant is listening to recorded material. Most people in my situation would have given up by now but when going back to something that I have not listened to in a while, I understand more. And every now and then a little light bulb lights up in understanding a new word from its’ parts and the context. Next Sat I start Chinese school so maybe that will help. My schedule screams that I don’t have time for Chinese school, but I need that exposure. Edited by Snowflake on 16 August 2009 at 1:07am 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| irrationale Tetraglot Senior Member China Joined 6042 days ago 669 posts - 1023 votes 2 sounds Speaks: English*, Spanish, Mandarin, Tagalog Studies: Ancient Greek, Japanese | Message 118 of 181 16 August 2009 at 8:42am | IP Logged | ||
For movies, right now I am watching American movies with Chinese subs, using the reverse subtitle method. I do watch a Chinese movie now and then...nothing specific to say, just whatever looks interesting, so I can't recall any specific favorites. Right now I am watching "senior year" or 高三. It is really a cool, a documentary/reality about the harsh senior year in China. If you want more info on movies PM me. For TV, I am watching 我的青春，谁做主. This is a Chinese series about some young people's modern lifes in Beijing, finding jobs, drama, love stories, etc. It is very good in my opinion, great characters and interweaving plots. Some characters speak the Beijing accent, which may or may not interest you, but the dialog is very fast and brutal (authentic) and my listening has markedly improved by watching it for 1 to 2 months alone. Good luck with your studies :) 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| bouda Senior Member United States Joined 5589 days ago 194 posts - 197 votes Speaks: English* | Message 119 of 181 16 August 2009 at 1:12pm | IP Logged | ||
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Thanks for the reply! I initially learned my Chinese from Taiwanese teachers, so I
actually have a bit of a (not a very strong) Taiwanese accent according to some people, which is a little unfortunate because there are some things about the common Taiwanese accent that I don't like. So now I really want to listen to more mainland materials, esp things in a Beijing accent as it's the place I'm mostly likely to visit. I can generally understand the accent (so far) but it would be very hard for me to imitate it. I'm never quite sure where to put my er's! I know I'd have an even harder time with some of the other mainland accents though. I wish I had a TV show to recommend in return but I can't quite think of one. A friend swears by 神探狄仁杰, which is a detective/period drama from the mainland, but I haven't watched it yet because I'm not sure how much it'll help me with my colloquial skills, given that it's historical... I kind of wish there were enough active Mandarin learners on this forum that we could have a book club or a TV-watching club or something else to push us to consistently work on a range of Chinese media and help each other out, like how (I believe) there's a Russian book club, but I guess that'd be a lot of trouble to get running anyway. Good luck with your studies, too! 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| irrationale Tetraglot Senior Member China Joined 6042 days ago 669 posts - 1023 votes 2 sounds Speaks: English*, Spanish, Mandarin, Tagalog Studies: Ancient Greek, Japanese | Message 120 of 181 05 October 2009 at 8:08am | IP Logged | ||
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It is hard to believe I started this one year ago! It seems like forever ago I was running through Pimsleur saying "May I ask a question? What time is it now?"
My Chinese fluency has improved significantly from the time I got back from China. I am almost to the proficient level, I just need to internalize some sentence forms and advanced vocab, as well as learn 2 or 3 more thousand words. I can talk about anything, but I pause and still circumlocute too much in more advanced topics. My vocab isn't what I would like it to be. When I got back from China I was bogged down in tons of due reviews and didn't formally learn a new word for 2 months. Of course I probably absorbed some casually. My official word count still stands at 4500 ish, 2000 ish characters. I just got done with all the due cards and will start the new cards finally, hoping to get a couple of thousand words, the rest of the HSK words, in 5 or 6 months. These days I am using my Chinese-Chinese dictionary I bought in China ever more, because as other advanced Chinese learners may know, the vocab essentially has no overlap with English, and gets worse the more advanced you go, until of course you hit the proverbs. While it is sometimes easy to derive a meaning based on the characters in words you already know, most of the time it is not, or there are many uses/contexts. The English-Chinese dictionary has become somewhat useless, and it is now ESSENTIAL to have a sentence in the ANKI card for context, which is why I use 5 field cards, as I described earlier. After writing Chinese for a straight year (14.59 days total according to ANKI), my Chinese handwriting has finally developed a style. Accordingly, I bought a fountain pen and now write the occasional Chinese letter. WAY more fun than writing English letters! Oh and my ears have finally adapted to the non-retroflex chinese accent (Fujian accent?) Edited by irrationale on 05 October 2009 at 8:13am 1 person has voted this message useful |
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