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Spanish "v" pronunciation | ||
Tags: Pronunciation | Spanish | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Specific Languages |  | |
| IronFist Senior Member United States Joined 6435 days ago 663 posts - 941 votes  Speaks: English* Studies: Japanese, Korean | Message 17 of 49 23 March 2010 at 7:14pm | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
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My first Spanish teacher was from Chile and she said she would confuse B and V in English. She said it was embarrassing because she would mix up the word "vowel" and "bowel" :D Edited by IronFist on 23 March 2010 at 7:14pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||||||||
| Cainntear Pentaglot Senior Member Scotland linguafrankly.blogsp Joined 6009 days ago 4399 posts - 7687 votes Speaks: Lowland Scots, English*, French, Spanish, Scottish Gaelic Studies: Catalan, Italian, German, Irish, Welsh | Message 18 of 49 23 March 2010 at 8:41pm | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
As for the approximant terminal D... Sometimes languages are affected by the "ghost" of dead features. I don't know any Latin, but a quick check of the conjugation and declension tables shows no endings that terminate in a D. If Latin couldn't end a word in D, it's possible it's the ghost of a Latin vowel that makes a terminal D (eg Madrid) act as though it's intervocalic.
I don't think you've quite understood me: my point is that a double R is precisely that -- two Rs, ie two single R phonemes that both become non-intervocalic and assimilate. Spanish has always recognised phonemes in it's alphabet, and it is notable that while ch, ll and ñ are considered "letters" by the Real Academia, rr is not. So I don't think RR is "a" phoneme, but really two identical phonemes. The interesting thing is in word endings. Latin could finish words with Rs, so it makes sense that Spanish can see it as a proper ending and therefore non-intervocalic, but most terminal Rs in Modern Spanish are in forms that would have been followed by a vowel in the original Latin. Looks like the simple fact of being able to say it at the end of a word killed off any ghost vowels. 2 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||||||||||||||
| Paz Newbie Chile Joined 5361 days ago 3 posts - 4 votes Speaks: Spanish* Studies: English | Message 19 of 49 23 March 2010 at 9:16pm | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
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They are exactly the same
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| Arekkusu Hexaglot Senior Member Canada bit.ly/qc_10_lec Joined 5379 days ago 3971 posts - 7747 votes Speaks: English, French*, GermanC1, Spanish, Japanese, Esperanto Studies: Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Estonian | Message 20 of 49 23 March 2010 at 9:18pm | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
Does Spanish have other double consonants or would this be the only one? A single double consonant would be unlikely. Do you think tierra is in fact tier and ra? This is a single morpheme. (Actually, it's tierr- and -a.) What about words that start with RR that end up in the second position of a 2 word compound? Edited by Arekkusu on 23 March 2010 at 9:20pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||||||||
| tractor Tetraglot Senior Member Norway Joined 5451 days ago 1349 posts - 2292 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, English, Spanish, Catalan Studies: French, German, Latin | Message 21 of 49 23 March 2010 at 9:38pm | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
Club, but thats obviously a recent loan.
Some, or maybe most, of the final Ds come from a Latin T. However, I don't think we should look for answers in Latin here. It's probably rather that in Spanish final D and intervocalic D tend to be pronounced the same way.
Just to complicate things without contradicting what you just said: R is pronounced like double RR in certain positions: when it is the first letter of a word and after L, N or S. Edited by tractor on 23 March 2010 at 9:41pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||||||||
| Cainntear Pentaglot Senior Member Scotland linguafrankly.blogsp Joined 6009 days ago 4399 posts - 7687 votes Speaks: Lowland Scots, English*, French, Spanish, Scottish Gaelic Studies: Catalan, Italian, German, Irish, Welsh | Message 22 of 49 23 March 2010 at 10:44pm | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
You're either contradicting me or you haven't understood me. I said that any non-intervocalic R is pronounced as a trill (=like RR), and that R is only a single flap when flanked by vowels on both sides. Am I wrong? For example, is "cerdo" pronounced with the full trill (RR) or not? 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||||||||
| tractor Tetraglot Senior Member Norway Joined 5451 days ago 1349 posts - 2292 votes Speaks: Norwegian*, English, Spanish, Catalan Studies: French, German, Latin | Message 23 of 49 24 March 2010 at 12:00am | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
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Then I misunderstood you.
Cerdo is usually pronounced with a flap, R. The R at the beginning of a word is pronounced as a rolled RR, even when it appears between vowels: la ropa [larropa] contra + revolucionario = contrarrevolucionario [kontrarreβoluθjonarjo] (The R is in fact doubled in writing.) Have a look at the article about the letter R in the Real Academia's Diccionario panhispánico de dudas: http://buscon.rae.es/dpdI/ Just enter R in the search field. Edited by tractor on 24 March 2010 at 12:06am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||||||||
| Johntm Senior Member United StatesRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5420 days ago 616 posts - 725 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Spanish | Message 24 of 49 24 March 2010 at 4:07am | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
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