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Germans can’t learn Schweitzerdeutsch | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Specific Languages |  | |
| schoenewaelder Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 5352 days ago 759 posts - 1197 votes  Speaks: English*, French Studies: German, Spanish, Dutch | Message 1 of 27 24 June 2010 at 4:59pm | IP Logged | ||
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From the New Zurcher Zeitung (in German)
http://www.nzz.ch/nachrichten/wissenschaft/gruezi_wohl_1.616 6489.html It's only a newspaper article, so it probably completely misrepresents the study, but apparently Germans have even more trouble learning Schweizerdeutsch than other nationalities do, although if they already speak another dialect it helps. Apparently the Swiss are much more irritated, offended, resentful, and unhelpful with Geman lerners than they are with others. The Germans are handicapped by the similarities between the languages, and so more inhibited about making mistakes (it almost feels as if you are speaking your own mother tongue incorrectly). But it strikes me that, appart from the general difficulties of learning Schweizerdeutsch (multiple dialects, predominantly a spoken language, so lack of materials available) the Germans suffer the same problem that English speakers have in the rest of the world. Trying to learn a local language, where everyone speaks your own language better than you do theirs. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| gedamara Diglot Newbie Albania Joined 5133 days ago 22 posts - 22 votes Speaks: German, Albanian* Studies: French, English | Message 2 of 27 24 June 2010 at 5:23pm | IP Logged | ||
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It's true , actually I'm not German but German is for me like my second native language .However I can't understand any single word of Schweizerdeutsch , it sounds so strange for me just like dutch (which makes me LMFAO)
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| Declan1991 Tetraglot Senior Member Ireland Joined 6231 days ago 233 posts - 359 votes Speaks: English*, German, Irish, French | Message 3 of 27 24 June 2010 at 7:41pm | IP Logged | ||
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Well it's similar to an American learning to speak like a Scottish person or so. So it's not surprising that it's difficult for Germans, simply because it's something you feel you can do already. However, it's misleading to say that it's easier for other nationalities to learn Schweizerdeutsch, that's just nonsense. A fluent Standard German speaker will learn Schweizerdeutsch far quicker that even a pretty good German speaker, because Swiss German is still pretty close to German.
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| cmj Octoglot Groupie Switzerland Joined 5130 days ago 58 posts - 191 votes Speaks: English*, German, Spanish, Ancient Greek, French, Arabic (classical), Latin, Italian | Message 4 of 27 24 June 2010 at 9:37pm | IP Logged | ||
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Germans trying to speak Swiss German generally just come across as ridiculous, or even offensive (although the Swiss themselves seem to be split on whether Germans should make an effort to speak Swiss German even though they sound silly, or whether they shouldn't even try). Like Declan says, it's as if a North American were to move to Scotland and try to speak like a Scot. At best he would sound like a ridiculous caricature(think Dick van Dyke in Mary Poppins).
That said, from what I've seen it's mostly immigrants from poorer countries who learn to speak Swiss German, since they pick up the language through interaction with the local people. North Americans and Western Europeans generally learn Hochdeutsch (with a Swiss accent) and acquire a passive understanding of the dialects. 6 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| schoenewaelder Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 5352 days ago 759 posts - 1197 votes Speaks: English*, French Studies: German, Spanish, Dutch | Message 5 of 27 25 June 2010 at 12:54pm | IP Logged | ||
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Just to add, people may not realise how different Schweizerdeutsch really is from Hochdeutsch. I can't judge myself, but from comments it seems that it is even less comprehensible to a German than the oft dicussed mutual intelligibility of the Scandanavian languages (with the provisio that, because the Swiss can speak and do write Hochdeutsch, the more advanced the language the more similar they become, so technical words etc can be easily identified).
I don't realy know why the Swiss continue with the pretence that they're speaking German. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| cmj Octoglot Groupie Switzerland Joined 5130 days ago 58 posts - 191 votes Speaks: English*, German, Spanish, Ancient Greek, French, Arabic (classical), Latin, Italian | Message 6 of 27 25 June 2010 at 1:19pm | IP Logged | ||
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Swiss German is about as different from Hochdeutsch as Dutch is. For a German unfamiliar with a related dialect, there is pretty much zero comprehensibility. The main reason Swiss German continues to be considered a dialect rather than an independent language is that it has no standard written form (indeed, Swiss German is often referred to as "Mundart" in contrast to "Schriftdeutsch"). Hochdeutsch is thus indispensable for the functioning of Swiss society, because its functions cannot be taken over by Swiss German as it currently exists.
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| maaku Senior Member United States Joined 5366 days ago 359 posts - 562 votes Speaks: English* | Message 7 of 27 25 June 2010 at 3:06pm | IP Logged | ||
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Swiss German is its own language. I just came back from Zurich and I found it impossible to decipher any meaning out of what the locals were saying (I speak Hochdeutsch, although not natively). The problem of course is that every single person is 100% fluent to a native level in Hochdeutsch as well, as it is the written language and language of instruction in schools. So unless you find someone interested in languages (and I did find a few) no one will prefer to speak to you in broken Swiss German when they could just as easily speak Hochdeutsch.
1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| orion Senior Member United States Joined 6813 days ago 622 posts - 678 votes Speaks: English* Studies: German, Russian | Message 8 of 27 25 June 2010 at 5:01pm | IP Logged | ||
I found this statement very amusing! Its about time the shoe is on the other foot for a change! Damn Germans with their perfect English... :D 4 persons have voted this message useful |
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