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Arabic Parallel Text for L/R in the Works | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Programs, Books & Tapes |  | |
| ic32987 Groupie United States Joined 6144 days ago 50 posts - 54 votes  Speaks: English* Studies: Arabic (Written) | Message 17 of 56 23 February 2011 at 2:57pm | IP Logged | ||
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I will also definitely buy. Personally, I like version 2 best. The lines used to separate
the passages make it easier for me to keep my place. But I have no real suggestions. I'm a big fan of the idea and effort. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Volte Tetraglot Senior Member Switzerland Joined 6243 days ago 4474 posts - 6726 votes Speaks: English*, Esperanto, German, Italian Studies: French, Finnish, Mandarin, Japanese | Message 18 of 56 23 February 2011 at 4:06pm | IP Logged | ||
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I second what Sprachprofi says: please make your texts available electronically. Between a physical book and a digital text, the latter is much more useful for L-R, because of pop-up dictionaries (as well as browser plugins for google translate, etc - it's surprisingly useful for getting a more 'word by word' meaning of phrases translated idiomatically).
She's also right about etexts being more affordable: shipping can easily end up dominating the cost of buying a book. Etexts also reduce costs for you. If you provide etexts, please use a simple, open format. HTML would be good - the tools I use for doing L-R are all browser plugins. One alternative I like would be if you'd provide both physical and electronic books - with the electronic versions included on a CD with the book, or for download to owners of the book. But if I had to choose digital or paper L-R material, digital definitely is better. Thank you for undertaking the making of Arabic L-R material. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| DavidW Hexaglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 6330 days ago 318 posts - 458 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, French, Italian, Persian, Malay Studies: Russian, Arabic (Written), Portuguese, German, Urdu | Message 19 of 56 23 February 2011 at 7:40pm | IP Logged | ||
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I will look into the digital version. Are PDFs still problematic with pop-up
dictionaries? Do you want to use the texts with ebook readers? HTML would be easy to do. I will have to get permission from the copyright holders first, so no promises yet. I wanted to talk about the different options for the formatting, and why the samples look like they do. You can align the two texts on different levels: Tight Alignment <.................................................> Loose Alignment Word Aligned...Clause Aligned...Sentance Aligned...Paragraph Aligned...Page Aligned Word Aligned Interlinear text - As words must correspond one-to-one, the English translation will be unidiomatic and perhaps unintelligable. Often used for religious texts, where each word is also often annotated with gramiatical notes, I don't think it really fits with the L/R method, where you are more concerned about global understanding that the exact meaning of specific words. You would have to make a new literal translation from scratch, and would be a massive task. Clause/Sentance aligned - This is what I showed in the example layouts as a two- column format. It's about as close an alignment you can get with an idiomatic translation. It allows you to quickly move your eyes from one text to the other without loosing your place. Disadvantage is that you must sometimes leave white space or reduce the letter spacing excessively to get the two texts to stay in sync, so it can look a bit untidy compared to a paragraph aligned text. Paragraph Aligned - this is what most parallel texts seem to use. It works quite well unless paragraphs are very long, like in some of Kafka's works. There is also the format followed by many texts on franklang.ru, the 'Ilyi Franka method.' A sample text is here. Here a translation and vocabulary is in the brackets. I find these a little less easy to read. People will probably use these materials in different ways, and different formatting provides different advantages. Do you agree that clause/sentance alignment in a two- column format is the way to go? Edited by DavidW on 23 February 2011 at 9:28pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| apparition Octoglot Senior Member United States Joined 6454 days ago 600 posts - 667 votes Speaks: English*, Arabic (Written), French, Arabic (Iraqi), Portuguese, German, Italian, Spanish Studies: Pashto | Message 20 of 56 24 February 2011 at 4:18am | IP Logged | ||
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I'm a big fan of the principles of L-R and parallel books, in general. Good on you,
DavidW, for taking on this task. As regards an internet-based, L-R-friendly source of authentic Arabic material, might I suggest naturalarabic.com. It violates a few of the principles of L-R (long texts, different authors), but it does some aspects splendidly. They've recently added a really cool search function across all their (400+) mini-articles, vocab quizzes, etc. Anyways, you might see how they've dealt with the same issues you have, albeit on an website. Note: I have no monetary interest in naturalarabic.com (except for subscribing for 7 bucks a month). I tend to come on HTLAL every once in awhile and always end up suggesting this site on the Arabic forums. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| KSAKSA Groupie Australia Joined 4949 days ago 65 posts - 99 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Arabic (Gulf) | Message 21 of 56 26 February 2011 at 3:45am | IP Logged | ||
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I like Version 4b and would prefer a hard copy, but that's just me.
You've taken on a mammoth task and I, for one, appreciate it. Please keep us all updated so we can know when we need to put our money where our mouths are :) 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Juаn Senior Member Colombia Joined 5149 days ago 727 posts - 1830 votes Speaks: Spanish* | Message 22 of 56 26 February 2011 at 4:55pm | IP Logged | ||
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I would definitely purchase printed versions of these books; I wouldn't bother with electronic ones. Regarding the audio though, I don't care if it is offered in download or disc form. I would also be interested in Persian, Urdu and Hebrew editions. The target-language text must have been originally written in that language however.
3 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Juаn Senior Member Colombia Joined 5149 days ago 727 posts - 1830 votes Speaks: Spanish* | Message 24 of 56 26 February 2011 at 6:09pm | IP Logged | ||
No, I don't want and am not willing to pay for some makeshift stack of paper off my printer, and I certainly won't strain my eyesight reading off an electronic screen or put up with the temperament of electronic gadgets. Like I said, I'd be interested in purchasing real book editions of this project. 3 persons have voted this message useful |
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