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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| ReneeMona Diglot Senior Member Netherlands Joined 5141 days ago 864 posts - 1274 votes  Speaks: Dutch*, EnglishC2 Studies: French | Message 9 of 43 03 May 2011 at 1:21pm | IP Logged | ||||||||||||||||||||
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Actually, in ieder geval is the right translation for “in any case”.
Zal is the first, second and third person singular form of zullen, which means “will, shall”. It’s an irregular verb so that’s probably why you couldn’t find it in your dictionary. Your translation was fine but I think I would translate it as: “I wish you a lot of luck and fun with your Dutch and I will keep an eye out in case you have any more questions.” Edited by ReneeMona on 04 May 2011 at 11:47pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||||||||||||||
| getreallanguage Diglot Senior Member Argentina youtube.com/getreall Joined 5277 days ago 240 posts - 371 votes Speaks: Spanish*, English Studies: Italian, Dutch | Message 10 of 43 03 May 2011 at 7:57pm | IP Logged | ||||||||||||||||||||
Literal translation: I find it very interesting how you the pronunciation op (in) a row move before you truly on the language begin. That I-zullen-imperfect I perhaps with Spanish also must do, since I op (at) the moment but a little bit tinker (not sure of inflection; looks like an infinitive) have. Free translation: I find it very interesting how you put the pronunciation in a row (put the pronunciation in order) before you truly start on the language. Perhaps I should have done that with Spanish too, since as of now I have only tinkered a little bit. Whew. That conditional sentence with 'zou' and two infinitives had me leafing through my Teach Yourself Dutch Grammar (which doesn't have such a streamlined layout either). I'm not that sure I translated it properly, of course. Also, I totally guessed the tense in the last part after the comma. I am not familiar yet with verbal constructions like 'aanmodderen ben'. The idiom there about putting my pronunciation in a row reminded me of the 'all your ducks in a row' expression in English. Either way, I think you should get crackin' on your pronunciation. Think of all the subvocalizing you're doing while reading, potentially solidifying wrong pronunciations it will take you much longer to correct further down the road! Oh, the horror! Such a terrible fate awaits us! Ok, maybe it's not so tragic, but I still recommend it. I definitely tackle it from the beginning to try to avoid false starts. (Also because I'm very ambitious when it comes to pronunciation, maybe even a perfectionist, but don't tell anyone.) Listen, parrot, read along. Y si tenés alguna pregunta, no dudes en preguntarme. Edited by getreallanguage on 03 May 2011 at 7:59pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||||||||||||||
| Vos Diglot Senior Member Australia Joined 5372 days ago 766 posts - 1020 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish Studies: Dutch, Polish | Message 11 of 43 04 May 2011 at 8:02am | IP Logged | ||||||||||||||||||||
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Hoi Getreal! Hoe gaat het? Ik wens je veel succes met je Nederlands ook, en dat je de taal heel veel genieten. Je bent
in goede handen met Renee! Ik zal je log lezen zijn, dus, tot straks. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||||||||||||||
| getreallanguage Diglot Senior Member Argentina youtube.com/getreall Joined 5277 days ago 240 posts - 371 votes Speaks: Spanish*, English Studies: Italian, Dutch | Message 12 of 43 04 May 2011 at 6:16pm | IP Logged | ||||||||||||||||||||
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Hoi Vos! Met mij gaat het goed vandaag, dank je! Hoe gaat het met jij jou? Renee has been very helpful indeed. With what I know so far I think I understand the meaning of what you said until the last sentence, in which I get the general meaning, but I don't really know what 'zijn' is doing there, so I can't say I really understand the tense or the 'temporal frame' of the sentence.
In ieder geval, dank je wel voor je goede wensen! Edited by getreallanguage on 15 May 2011 at 5:49pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||||||||||||||
| ReneeMona Diglot Senior Member Netherlands Joined 5141 days ago 864 posts - 1274 votes Speaks: Dutch*, EnglishC2 Studies: French | Message 13 of 43 05 May 2011 at 8:40am | IP Logged | ||||||||||||||||||||
That was way too complex again, wasn’t it? Sorry. I’ll try to keep it simpler next time. Op een rijtje zetten means to put in order or to sort out in order to make it clearer. It doesn’t necessarily mean you’re literally putting things in a row, but you’re making some kind of an overview. You can say “even alles op een rijtje” to mean “let me get this straight”. Zou is the 1st, 2nd and 3rd person singular of zouden which is a cognate of “should” but it only means “would”. To say “should” we have to add moeten / “must” so you get dat zou ik ook moeten doen / “I should do that too”. Zijn aan het + infinitief is the present progressive. It’s a little bit like “being at it” in English. Ik ben aan het lezen = I am at it reading = I am reading. Aanmodderen has the word modder in it, which means mud so you’re literally “mudding at”. It means you’re working on something without any kind of plan or guide. You’re not necessarily doing things wrong, but there’s a good chance you are. My own translation: “I think it’s very interesting how you sort out the pronunciation / make an overview of the pronunciation before you really start on the language. I should perhaps do that with Spanish as well, since I’m kind of just muddling through at the moment.” Don’t worry, I’m already parroting along with Assimil and Michel Thomas and I think I’m doing alright so far. I don’t think it’s too boastful to say I already sound a whole lot better than the MT students. ;-)
Vos, ik hoop dat je het niet erg vind dat ik je stukje verbeterd heb. Het was belangrijk omdat getreallanguage precies het deel wat incorrect was niet begreep dus ik kon het nogal moeilijk gaan uitleggen. :) 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||||||||||||||
| Vos Diglot Senior Member Australia Joined 5372 days ago 766 posts - 1020 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish Studies: Dutch, Polish | Message 14 of 43 06 May 2011 at 3:39am | IP Logged | ||||||||||||||||||||
Not at all Renee, it's good for both Getreal and I. Although I see that my Spanish has creeped into the way I think in het Nederlands. Want toen ik Ik zal je log lezen zijn, bedoelde ik I will be reading your log, en in het Spaans zou ik voy a estar leyendo - estaré leyendo zegen. Maar misschien dat zou ook een fout zijn en zou ik beter voy a leer/seguir tu log zegen. Één ding is zeker, heb ik nog veel studeren moeten doen. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||||||||||||||
| getreallanguage Diglot Senior Member Argentina youtube.com/getreall Joined 5277 days ago 240 posts - 371 votes Speaks: Spanish*, English Studies: Italian, Dutch | Message 15 of 43 15 May 2011 at 5:38am | IP Logged | ||||||||||||||||||||
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Ik kom met vragen, some of them about pronouns.
ReneeMona: I understand your first correction 100% (object pronoun instead of subject pronoun), but not the second. Is 'dank je voor je goede wensen' ungrammatical or just unidiomatic? If it's unidiomatic, I'll happily toss it to the side for the idiomatic option. But if it's ungrammatical, I'd like to understand why! In ieder geval, hoe gaat het met je Castiliaans? My questions about Dutch pronouns: - Teach Yourself Dutch gives 'je' as the 'weak' form of 'jullie' as an object pronoun. Teach Yourself beginner's Dutch and Teach Yourself Dutch grammar contradict it and say 'jullie' (object pronoun) has no weak form, i.e. is just like the subject pronoun for jullie (identical forms for weak and strong). What's the deal? (Also, just how do you pronounce 'jullie'? Where does the stress fall?) - I have gathered from observation that after a preposition, Dutch pronouns behave much like English pronouns, i.e. the object pronoun forms are used. That is, for example: met mij, met jou, met hem, met haar, met het, met ons, met jullie, met hen. Is this correct? - TYD and Teach Yourself beginner's Dutch tell me that when referring to a 'thing', that is, an object (as in an 'it', not as in a grammatical object), I need to use hij/hem (subject/object) for 'de' words and het for 'het' words. However the Wikipedia article is much more nuanced and leaves me confused. I'd appreciate a nod in the right direction. Also, if this is true, then can I use the weak forms of hij/hem with objects that are 'de' words (in speaking, of course)? This last one sounds like a bit of a silly question but my sources are not being very explicit. I've finally gotten a respite from my exams and as of today I've gone through most of lesson 4 (les vier) of TYD. It feels good to go back to studying Nederlands. Ik vind Nederlands erg lekker leuk. Edited by getreallanguage on 15 May 2011 at 10:48pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||||||||||||||
| ReneeMona Diglot Senior Member Netherlands Joined 5141 days ago 864 posts - 1274 votes Speaks: Dutch*, EnglishC2 Studies: French | Message 16 of 43 15 May 2011 at 4:18pm | IP Logged | ||||||||||||||||||||
I changed it because it sounded better to me but both are grammatically sound and commonly used. Your original version was correct as well but I personally just don’t like the two “je”’s in the sentence. It makes it sound inelegant to my ears. I guess I was just forcing my taste on you. ;-)
Ik denk dat het wel aardig gaat maar jij kan het zelf waarschijnlijk beter beoordelen dan ik, aangezien ik gister een poging heb gedaan om wat Spaans te schrijven in m’n log. Mijn passieve vaardigheden gaan veel sneller vooruit dan de actieven maar over het algemeen ben ik er wel positief over. Ik heb gisteren zelfs al een mini-gesprekje in het Spaans gevoerd op m’n werk.
I’ve seen this claim before and I’m inclined to agree with the ones who say there is no weak form of jullie. This mainly because if it were je, it should be possible to use the plural form of verbs with je but that’s definitely ungrammatical. It would also strike me as extremely odd if someone addressed multiple people with je. The only possibly I might be willing to accept is if people use je when they mean ‘you and others not present’ but I would personally still say jullie there.
The stress falls on the first syllable but the ‘u’ is interesting. If we look purely at the spelling, it should be a short -u but it’s also commonly pronounced as a long –uu sound. Perhaps we confuse it with juli? I’m not sure.
Yes, I think that’s pretty much a general rule. The only difference with English, that I can think of at the moment, is that in English it’s become acceptable to also use the object pronoun after ‘than’ in a comparison, while in Dutch this is still incorrect and though it is becoming more and more common, it’s still very much frowned upon. A related mistake is replacing dan with als so you get things like; hij is langer als mij, literally “he is taller as me”. This is the undisputed king of my many pet peeves. Just writing it makes me cringe with horror. ;-)
I was a little confused by the Wikipedia article, probably because it explains all the things I do subconsciously, but I think it says basically the same thing as your books; common-gendered objects are referred to with hij/hem and neuter words with het/’t. The distinction between male and female words has completely disappeared in AN but I know Flemish still uses it and maybe some Southern dialects as well. Some things like the moon, ships, the sea and love may be occasionally referred to with zij but this has more to do with romanticism than grammar. Waar is de tafel? Hij staat in de hoek. Ik heb een nieuwe jas gekocht. Hij is rood met gouden strepen. De hond is weggelopen. We hebben hem sinds zondag niet meer gezien. Enzovoorts.
Lekker can either mean “good” as in “having a nice taste” or it can mean “sexually attractive”. In your sentence, leuk would work better because it means “nice, fun”, which is what I assume you meant. :) 2 persons have voted this message useful |
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