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Active Study time vs Review time | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies |  | |
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6392 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes  4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 17 of 27 01 September 2012 at 12:53am | IP Logged | |||||
In fact, I find that if I only do single word cards, it might be hard to recognize a word in real texts the first few times I see it. I would be able to translate it L1-L2 but not necessarily understand it instantly. Meh. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6392 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 18 of 27 01 September 2012 at 1:19am | IP Logged | |||||
Q:speak A:hablar and with that little setting on, that you input the answer and it's compared to the answer field? for single-word cards, that's definitely what I prefer (and I've done that a lot with a non-SRS program), but IMO it's much better to do that with cloze deletions. I also prefer to have a custom field where I put the answer, so that I could add some notes to the main answer field, and I also like putting the complete sentence there, maybe with the word bolded. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| frenkeld Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 6738 days ago 2042 posts - 2719 votes Speaks: Russian*, English Studies: German | Message 19 of 27 01 September 2012 at 1:40am | IP Logged | |||||
A. Arguelles is one such learner. He described his approach in the seventh post of this thread. It's good stuff, so I'll quote it here in full: "Since you find this helpful, I will give some more details of the way that I have gone about learning to read literature in Russian and other foreign languages. The first step is to use actual bilingual texts, with the target language on one page and a translation on the facing page. I keep one index finger under one sentence, the other under its counterpart, and I slowly and carefully compare everything. I am not really "reading" at this point, but rather analyzing the language using interesting reading matter. The second step is to use "readers," i.e., books that contain annotated excerpts of literature with explanatory notes and, most importantly, vocabulary and an index that is specially keyed to these texts so that finding the meaning of unknown words is much easier than it is by using a regular dictionary. I usually make enlarged photocopies of the text first and then write the meaning of all new words directly in the space underneath them. I then read and reread these texts many times. The third step is begin reading "easy" literature unaided, i.e., material for native children or adolescents. The fourth step is what I described in an earlier post, namely using not bilingual texts but an original text and a translation in tandem, reading first a portion of the translation, then the original itself. What portion? If all I can handle is a paragraph or a page at a time, then it is better to keep working with actual bilingual texts. At this stage, as I wrote before, it is initially best to read a full chapter at a time. At first I may have to read them back to back, but I find that it is better not to do so, but rather to read the original later in the day. Eventually, I read the entire translated work first, then the original. I never use a dictionary at this stage, but just keep on reading. With Russian, I went through most of Tolstoy, Dostoyevsky, Turgenev, and Checkov this way, as well as some Oblomov and Gogol. I then passed the "airplane test," as I call it, taking a novel that I had not read in translation before with me as my sole companion on an intercontinental flight, and reading it with interest, enjoyment, and understanding the whole time. I cannot stress strongly enough how important it is to avoid using a dictionary until you have gotten past these stages. Doing so harms you more than it helps you, for it slows you down too much and breaks your concentration. I have always found that using a dictionary is only profitable after I have gotten past this fourth step. Again, I generally try to look up only "known unknowns," i.e., words that I have seen often enough to recognize them ("there's that damn word again--what the hell does it mean?") or even better actually remember them and say to myself, not necessarily while reading, but simply while ruminating, "I know that I don't know what X means--it seems like it means such and such, but I wonder..." When I finally look it up, I never forget it, whereas if I use a dictionary too early, I find myself looking up the same word repeatedly." Edited by frenkeld on 01 September 2012 at 1:42am 7 persons have voted this message useful | ||||||
| frenkeld Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 6738 days ago 2042 posts - 2719 votes Speaks: Russian*, English Studies: German | Message 20 of 27 01 September 2012 at 2:01am | IP Logged | |||||
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Besides SRS there is a second issue that can be brought up, that of whether to use a dictionary while reading. They are easier to consult nowadays if you are into ebooks, but even then looking up a word can break the flow. Kato Lomb was a polyglot who did keep notebooks, but she was pretty careful with dictionaries.
She described her approach in a book that can be (legally) downloaded from this page. Edited by frenkeld on 01 September 2012 at 2:17am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| grunts67 Diglot Senior Member CanadaRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5097 days ago 215 posts - 252 votes Speaks: French*, English Studies: Spanish, Russian | Message 21 of 27 01 September 2012 at 2:02am | IP Logged | |||||
Interesting. I am looking to do sentence and cloze deletions when my level will be high enough. In fact, I am trying this, at the moment, for words I see in my grammar workbook (really basically stuff) that I need to learn to do the exercises (translation mostly) without always having to look at my vocabulary sheet. Also, the next book I'm going to do reuse the same word, so that part of the reason. So basically: - I check the vocabulary of 2 to 4 units before I am there. - I write down the vocabulary on a sheet of paper. - I do Iversen's method (with the reviews). - I write down the words later or the next day in Anki. - I review my Anki deck (40 news cards per day) every morning with a good cup of coffee :) PS: I am unemployed at the moment and I have a LOT of free time. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| ZombieKing Bilingual Diglot Senior Member Canada Joined 4322 days ago 247 posts - 324 votes Speaks: English*, Mandarin* | Message 22 of 27 01 September 2012 at 3:40am | IP Logged | |||||
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Oh I actually don't have any L1 - L2 cards for German in Anki. If I do start making some though, I might make cloze deletions :)
And Frenkeld, that anecdote about Prof Arguelles is very interesting. It makes sense that if he didn't do any active review of words that he searched up in dictionaries, that he'd have to continually search them up over and over again. But what about for those of us that input learned words in Anki for example? Does searching up words still hinder our studies? I think if you choose not to do active reviewing, then maybe his way is the best way. Edited by ZombieKing on 01 September 2012 at 3:40am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| g-bod Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5777 days ago 1485 posts - 2002 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, German | Message 23 of 27 01 September 2012 at 9:37am | IP Logged | |||||
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I think rereading texts over again still counts as active review.
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| ZombieKing Bilingual Diglot Senior Member Canada Joined 4322 days ago 247 posts - 324 votes Speaks: English*, Mandarin* | Message 24 of 27 01 September 2012 at 10:08am | IP Logged | |||||
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It doesn't say anything about him rereading books in the above post though. Are you sure he rereads books?
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