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Michel Thomas Mandarin Foundation Course | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Programs, Books & Tapes |  | |
| Kugel Senior Member United States Joined 6332 days ago 497 posts - 555 votes  Speaks: English* | Message 1 of 70 15 November 2007 at 11:03am | IP Logged |
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I received this course a few days ago, and I was only able to do the first two CDs so I can't really comment on this program as a whole. There is a huge improvement in comparison to the Spanish, French, Italian, and German editions. The packaging is done very nice with a DVD case for every 2 CDs, all of which slip into a glossed cardboard case. The program seems more organized because of the little pamphlet that haves a description of what's being taught for every track. A native speaker saying the answer at the end is really nice, and it's shocking to think that the earlier courses didn't have these native speakers.
Because the grammar is less complicated than the European languages, and because this is probably the last chance for anyone to create the MT method courses(they have to make this right otherwise this method is sort of out of the window), I'm really hoping that at least 2/3 of the grammar is covered in detail. I'm already kind of skeptical because already on CD 2 track 1 there is a little bit about hen3 being confusing. All I know so far is to use it when there is a situation involving a description, using a complement. The narrator didn't go into this. Instead he mentions that it's a dummy word, and that it fulfills the two-syllable meter rule. Well, what happens when the adjective/verb is more than one syllable? Would you still use hen3? From looking on google I've found that I'm supposed to use hen when I'm in a situation when I'm describing something: I hen3 awesome He hen3 slave You hen3 Norman What about when I want to use 'very'? I hen3 hen3 awesome? I don't remember the narrator going over this. Sort of disappointing. Edited by Kugel on 15 November 2007 at 11:05am 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| aru-aru Triglot Senior Member Latvia Joined 6251 days ago 244 posts - 331 votes Speaks: Latvian*, English, Russian | Message 2 of 70 15 November 2007 at 2:30pm | IP Logged |
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you just use a different word for the same idea of very: really 真 (zhen1), uncomonly 非常 (fei1chang2) or something, so, in order to express the idea of 'very' you just say Wo3 zhen1 lei4 (i am very/really tired)
If the adjective is more than one syllable you'd still use that hen3 thing as a dummy word. As to the course itself, i would like to know what other people think of it, because i had hopes they'd make it good. 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| LilleOSC Senior Member United States lille.theoffside.comRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 6485 days ago 545 posts - 546 votes 4 sounds Speaks: English* Studies: French, Arabic (Written) | Message 3 of 70 15 November 2007 at 7:31pm | IP Logged |
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Keep us updated with how it goes. I think the addition of native speakers in this course really is a good sign. That is one of the key components that I heard are missing in other Michel Thomas courses.
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| sheetz Senior Member United States Joined 6171 days ago 270 posts - 356 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Japanese, French, Mandarin | Message 4 of 70 15 November 2007 at 9:13pm | IP Logged |
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Thanks for the report! Is this the UK version? I'm thinking about getting the US version when it comes out next year.
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| volapuk49 Tetraglot Groupie United States Joined 6061 days ago 73 posts - 86 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, Yiddish, Modern Hebrew Studies: Esperanto | Message 5 of 70 18 November 2007 at 4:27pm | IP Logged |
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I am the author and co-teacher of the Michel Thomas Mandarin Foundation and Advanced courses. I really
appreciate your taking the time to comment on the course. You know, I have spent quite a lot of time creating this course so it is wonderful to hear any feedback. Up until now I feel like I have been sitting in a vacuum! The question about the use of hen3 is a very important and practical one. Aru-aru commented with some helpful solutions. In spoken Chinese if one wishes to emphasize 'very' with hen3 one common approach is to simply put more emphasis on the word. This is mentioned in the course. In preparing the course everything has been run by two native speakers and many discussions were held as to the best and least complicated way to present the material. In addition, two trials each consisting of two students with no background in Mandarin were conducted for the Foundation. All of this has been helpful in making the course more effective. I studied with Michel Thomas from 1995 until shortly before his death in January, 2005. His intent was to instruct me in his approach to learning and teaching. Please let me know if there is any way in which I may be of help. Take care. Harold Goodman Edited by volapuk49 on 19 November 2007 at 7:16am 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| sheetz Senior Member United States Joined 6171 days ago 270 posts - 356 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Japanese, French, Mandarin | Message 6 of 70 18 November 2007 at 5:49pm | IP Logged |
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Dr Goodman, it's great that you're here. Two questions. Could you estimate the amount of vocabulary covered in the beginner and advanced course, and are there any plans to come out with a vocabulary course for Chinese? Thanks.
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| volapuk49 Tetraglot Groupie United States Joined 6061 days ago 73 posts - 86 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, Yiddish, Modern Hebrew Studies: Esperanto | Message 7 of 70 18 November 2007 at 8:37pm | IP Logged |
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The Foundation has slightly more than one hundred words. The Advanced is scheduled to be recorded in
December. I estimate that it will have a similar number, too, though please don't hold me to this. Hodder has indicated that they do want a vocabulary course. This, obviously, will be where you will get the bulk of the vocabulary, extra phrases and more essential patterns. This should come out sometime next year. Compared to all of the Western language Michel Thomas courses the Mandarin course has less vocabulary. Though I have yet to listen to the other new courses I wouldn't be surprised if the Chinese course has less vocabulary than any of them. Why? Of all of the language courses presently offered by Hodder in this series the language with the fewest cognates is Chinese. Cognates were one of the major ways Michel taught. These similar words ( English - national, Spanish - nacional) rapidly provided students with an enormous vocabulary and a feeling of success. Chinese has very few cognates. One can only do so much with the words mango, coffee, and juice which are cognates in both languages. So another method had to be found to guarantee rapid results. There are a number of things which I have found via trial and error ( a lot of the latter!) which absolutely work. You will find they form the backbone of the course. The goal of this course is to teach you to communicate with Chinese speakers. This is largely accomplished by grounding you in the essential patterns which are the motor that runs spoken Mandarin. Michel Thomas used to emphasize to me that the verbs are the meat of any Western language. They are vital in learning languages. However, in spoken Chinese there are very specific templates which once learned will enable you to communicate in a powerful way. Of course, verbs are vital and you will get them, too. Though you will acquire more vocabulary as you progress in your learning ultimately you will discover that this language is pattern driven. Hence, learning the patterns, in my experience, is the quickest way to be successful with spoken Mandarin. The Foundation and Advanced will give you the basic patterns. When you complete the first hour of the Mandarin Foundation you will be creating your own sentences. Jingtao, the native speaker, and I shall lead you step by step through the language. You will find that you are really communicating quite well. Incidentally, a British correspondant who has yet to complete the course recently wrote to tell me that he is already speaking with the staff at a local Chinese establishment. Everything he knows comes from the course. You will have the rest of your life to learn more and more vocabulary. You will also have the immense satisfaction of immediately being able to actually communicate in Chinese with no memorization, homework, testing, flashcards, and many of the other ways commonly used by language learners ( including myself). I was very suspicious of this method when I first encountered it in 1995. However, I now know that it works. You can be the judge. Take care. Harold Goodman Edited by volapuk49 on 19 November 2007 at 7:16am 1 person has voted this message useful | |
| Kugel Senior Member United States Joined 6332 days ago 497 posts - 555 votes Speaks: English* | Message 8 of 70 19 November 2007 at 2:57pm | IP Logged |
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I'm still a little confused on the 'hen3' usage, mainly because of this two-syllable rule. Why exactly is it called a two-syllable meter rule when there are obviously more then two syllables in some cases? There was a contrast between 'is' and 'doing' in the lesson.
Wo3 shi4 mang2 ren2. I am a busy person. Wo3 hen3 mang2 gong2. Does this mean, "I am doing busy work?" Or am I way off? Edited by Kugel on 19 November 2007 at 2:58pm 1 person has voted this message useful |
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