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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| Kappa Groupie Japan Joined 5518 days ago 99 posts - 172 votes  | Message 49 of 292 09 March 2012 at 10:32pm | IP Logged | ||||||||||||||||||||
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Howdy!
Since it's already posted on Lang-8, I'll go through it quick and simple, and let other folks do the actual job. And where'd the professionals on this forum go? They do much better at explaining stuff than most natives including myself. I have no idea as to how things work in Japanese and my brain's still half asleep. So please bear with me and I'm sorry if there's something incorrect. *ちょっと、コンビに買いに行きます。 ちょっと、コンビニに行きます。 "ちょっと、コンビニ買いに行きます。" could be interpreted as "I'm going to buy a convenient store/I'll go buy a store", although no one would actually in life take it so. They would just figure it's "に" that's omitted and still jokingly ask if you are actually going to buy a whole store. That happened to me a few times. You could also say "ちょっと、コンビニに行ってきます。/ちょ っとコンビニ(に)行ってくる。", which I believe is somewhat more suited here although the example above is perfectly fine as it is. Since it's everyday converstion between two people close to each other, I think it's a tad unusual to use polite forms. One thing is that the particles "に" and "を" are often omitted in informal contexts. Also, you'd say "コンビニに買いに行きます" to emphasise where you are buying said thing. And no object of the verb "買う" is mentioned before so you should either include one in the sentence or use a different verb. 黄色と赤の花を買いたいんですから (黄色と赤の花を買いたいんです。) It doesn't really sound right to me, especially in this context, I guess. I sort of corrected it in the parenthesis but it still sounds a bit weird (mostly because of the given context). For the reason I mentioned earlier, you could just forget about being polite and it would be much easier. (i.e. "黄色と赤の花を買いたいから。") *今週に, 一本９９センツで買うことができるよ (今週は、一本99セントで買うことができるよ 。) Almost all nouns adopted from foreign languages are singular. A well-known exception is foot (as a unit of length). They use feet. I've personally never heard foot used. 一緒にお昼食べない? なに食べたい? 軽い食事を食べるほうが良い (軽い食事(のほうが)が良い。/軽い食事が食 べたい。) It's grammatically not wrong but it doesn't really fully fit the context. It sounds like a general statement. If provided with appropriate context, it could mean something like "You should eat a light meal (in the evening/when you have a hangover/etc)." 昨日マックを食べ過ぎた。朝は*アップルだ けでおなかがまたいっぱい! (昨日マックを食べ過ぎた。(今)朝はりんごだ けでお腹がいっぱい(になった)。) Why katakanise "apple"???? Orange is okay, pineapple is also okay, and so is pineapple [Edit: I meant to say apple pie] but apple is most definitely not. That's gotta draw a clear line, eh? ;) And here's my attemp at colloquial "translation": どこ行くの？ ちょっとコンビニ。 (黄色と赤の)花買いたいから。/(黄色と赤の) 花買いに。 今週は、一本99セントで買えるから。/今週は , 一本99セントで買えるし。 一緒にお昼食べない？ 何食べたい？ 何か軽い物がいい。 昨日マック食べ過ぎた。今朝はリンゴだけで お腹いっぱいになった。 Although I'd personally never say "食べない？" like that as I'm not from Eastern Japan. Gives me the creeps. Maybe you could make another account for another two languages, if that's allowed. I hope someone gives proper corrections and explanations there on Lang-8 (or any one of the "professionals" here, on the forum). Best, Kappa Edited by Kappa on 10 March 2012 at 11:06pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||||||||||||||
| Sunja Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 6083 days ago 2020 posts - 2295 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Mandarin | Message 50 of 292 10 March 2012 at 2:42pm | IP Logged | ||||||||||||||||||||
The professionals are probably out there somewhere but chances are they won't know to come in here!
Actually it's helpful just knowing what's right and what's wrong. I never expect an explanation and I'm just happy if someone takes the time to look at what I'm doing.
you're right! I forgot the に!
Aaah, just like ﾄﾞﾗ ! -- oo, I have to remember that. this is a really good tip!
(lol) this was an actual conversation where my husband and I had eaten at McDonalds the previous night. I was still full the next day and I wanted to eat light. I still have trouble tying my thoughts together in Japanese.
Oh man, I completely forgot about りんご! It's been so long since I've used it, it slipped my mind!
Your comments and corrections are very helpful! Thanks a lot :) Edited by Sunja on 10 March 2012 at 9:07pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||||||||||||||
| Kappa Groupie Japan Joined 5518 days ago 99 posts - 172 votes | Message 51 of 292 10 March 2012 at 11:04pm | IP Logged | ||||||||||||||||||||
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I try to provide some sort of explanation because I don't really like not knowing "why". Just simple corrections won't cut it for me, unfortunately. I'm a very needy baby, greedy baby, indeed. ;)
It's such a shame they hardly ever visit here. They can do so much to fellow learners. They may be just busy with their studies and life. Oh well. Well, this is not the place to seek for such explanations and corrections anyway. I like to read your log and other people's as well. (And I absolutely love lengthy posts. I get joy from reading. I'm still not an avid reader though.) I admire you are making effort to learn multiple languages, with a family of your own. It reminds me to get back out there and hit the books, which I seldom do due to my laziness. As I said, it's still understandable without the particle に, but some people (such as myself) might make fun jokingly if you're close to the person. And it's not the problem. The problem, if it is such, is that you left out the object of the verb "買う". You could either mention one in the sentence (i.e. ちょっとコンビニに花(を)買いに行ってくる) or just go without it (i.e. ちょっとコンビニ(に)行ってくる). I'm not sure what you mean by ﾄﾞﾗ, but you might have meant ドル, which is short for ドルラル (dollar)? (Unless, of course, you are refering to a certain Mahjong term.) It came into Japanese in the Meiji era through Dutch, not English. :) Million Dollar Baby, the film, is katakanised as ミリオンダラーベイビー because it's from English. I really don't see a point katakanising already perfectly understandable English though... These things happen all the time, sadly. And a little follow-up on "feet", it's primarily used to describe height, as far as I know (i.e. "The plane is flying at 5,000 feet.") They wouldn't tell you they are 6'5" or 130lb. We use the metric system just like a lot of other countries. Except you still hear old Japaense units in constructions (i.e. 尺, 寸). Also 升 and 合. 1升 equals 10合 and 1合 is about 0.18 litre. They are mostly used to describe liquor bottles, especially 日本酒 and 焼酎. On the labels of those products, you may see the metric system, but people still refer to the bottles with the Japanese units (一升瓶, 四合瓶, etc). It's really tough for me to put things together in English, too. I virtually speak not a word of English. I've neglected speaking for so long my brain is just incapable. And mere 2,500 hours of TV shows just won't do it. This is why you should practice speaking from the beginning, to somehow make your brain used to the process. Practice makes perfect, though it never seems to get close to "perfection". I doubt there's such a thing. You may be too used to katakanised words to even have thought of apple in Katakana! Be aware, there are some people who really dislike them. I'm okay with them, most of the times as I use them all the time but when there's already perfectly good equivalents in Japanese, I don't see a point. And at last, it's always our pleasure to serve you, ma'am. ;) Best, Kappa 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||||||||||||||
| Sunja Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 6083 days ago 2020 posts - 2295 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Mandarin | Message 52 of 292 11 March 2012 at 12:10pm | IP Logged | ||||||||||||||||||||
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Sorry, ドル is what I meant. Oh my, I have a lot of catching up to do!
I'm averaging one piece of writing for Turkish and French every two days. That should help get me in shape before June. I've decided to knock myself down a notch on my "goals list" and shoot for B2 instead of C1. If I can't converse at B2 then C1 would be too risky. It costs over 100 euros here, which is not bad but it would be best if I were to pass. I don't want to get in over my head (I probably already am!) I've also tried doing transcriptions of "Ecoute.podcast.de" to help my listening and -maybe- my vocabulary. It's hard because I don't pay premium and there's no way to check what I've written. I looked at the excercises at the website and there was some indication of what I'd gotten wrong. I wrote "bouton" and it was "bulletin" for example. Not a very good excercise but at least I learn a little. I actually have a newspaper subscription (Revue de la Presse) but the articles are way to difficult for me to try transcribe. I'll keep trying with Ecoute. I'm also going back to Assimil (the first) and trying to activate all the lessons. The lessons are stale and rote but it's good for review. http://www.rfi.fr/lffr/questionnaires/143/questionnaire_956. asp has some good excercises for the B1/B2 level. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||||||||||||||
| Sunja Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 6083 days ago 2020 posts - 2295 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Mandarin | Message 53 of 292 11 March 2012 at 2:37pm | IP Logged | ||||||||||||||||||||
I just transcribed something from "Ecoute" and it's not that bad. It was a lot better than "Voter". this is about shopping. I googled what I couldn't spell and I think I got most of it:
This is still full of giant, huge mistakes and I'll try to clean it up later, but I think if I do this on a regular basis then what I learn will outweigh the problems. I was able to strengthen my vocabulary with words like "galerie marchande"=mall and "horaires d'ouvertures"= business hours. Edited by Sunja on 11 March 2012 at 6:44pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||||||||||||||
| Takato Tetraglot Senior Member HungaryRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5046 days ago 249 posts - 276 votes Speaks: Hungarian*, EnglishB2, GermanB2, Japanese | Message 54 of 292 16 March 2012 at 2:07pm | IP Logged | ||||||||||||||||||||
It's better for hearing every sound better, don't you think? As for me, I liked Spotlight Radio at least. They talk slowly there, too.
Maybe you should use a method similar to that of Benny Lewis next time when learning a new language in case you want more practical words down pat first. I myself like it better to have a structured book which I can follow. A book teaches grammar and many useful words so I can fill in the gaps of my knowledge using native materials later on. I don't know if books concentrating on the most useful spoken words exist apart from phrase books. Edited by Takato on 16 March 2012 at 2:10pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||||||||||||||
| Sunja Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 6083 days ago 2020 posts - 2295 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Mandarin | Message 55 of 292 17 March 2012 at 4:14pm | IP Logged | ||||||||||||||||||||
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Thanks for reading Takato! I saw your log just now and it looks like you've been busy with all your languages!
Me, I haven't been very busy with languages, unfortunately. (Get ready for some major grumbling:) I'm going to have to start working on my shoulder again. I dropped doing my therapy and it's gotten really stiff. It's taking a long time for it to get back to normal. My daughter broke her arm a few days ago and she only has to wear her cast for three weeks. Kids heal so much faster than adults! I have to do my taxes (*groan*) for the US and for Germany this weekend. I haven't earned an US income in over 10 years and they still make me fill out that 1040 form and my foreign earned income every year. Geez. Luckily the US forms are easy. German forms are a pain in the tuckus since I'm self-employed. The only thing I managed to do this week is transcribe another episode of Ecoute --"Les Soldes". This one went pretty well and I feel like it's a good level for me right now. "Using French" is a little bit much so I'll keep it on the backburner. No other news. I'll try to get to Lang-8 this weekend after I've finished doing my GuV Rechnung for the good people at the FA. I'll play "Tax Man" really loud while I'm filling it out. Now where to start...ヾ(´･ ･｀｡)ノ” 1 person has voted this message useful | |||||||||||||||||||||
| Sunja Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 6083 days ago 2020 posts - 2295 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Mandarin | Message 56 of 292 17 March 2012 at 7:09pm | IP Logged | ||||||||||||||||||||
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I just finished my GuV (Gewinn und Verlust Ermittlung) woo-hoo!
Here's some vocabulary that I learned today after doing much puzzling and googling. I transcribed the podcast then I googled the unclear parts (phonetically) and I'm very proud of these transcriptions because it wasn't easy.. Bonjour a toute et a tous -- Hello one and all (I think) Les soldes d'hiver ont démarré il y a quelques jours en France. The winter sales started a few days ago in France. (démarré is a new verb for me) ...selon à sondage Ipsos according to research/Umfrage by Ipsos (I googled Ipsos) Le Ministre de l'economie François Baroin, il a donné le coupe le ruban des soldes a Paris en coupant traditionelle ruban rouge devant la camera et le micro The French economic minister FB, he gives a ribbon cutting ceremony for the sales in Paris, in cutting a traditional red ribbon in front of the camera and microphone. je cite, "favorisé la consumation dans une période un peu morose. I quote, "favorises buying during a somewhat morose period. (I love it when I rediscover my old, lost English vernacular!) Les premiers clients des soldes sont souvent des personnes qui suive la mode et ... exactement ces quelles cherche. The first customers of the sales are often those who follow fasion and (know) exactly that/what they are looking for. dérépage un magasin quelques jours avant les soldes pour trouver les vêtements de leurs rêves. slip into a store a few days before the sales in order to find the clothes of their dreams. (I'm not sure if dérépage is what I heard but either way I learned a new word) près de deux Français sur trois furent des soldes sur internet en visitant des boutiques en ligne et autre cyber-commerçants. Almost 2 out of three French carry out the sales through the internet in visiting online shos and other cyber merchants. (I like "cyber merchants") le premier grand magasin sur la même de décrive Emil Zola dans son roman, Au bonheur des dames . the first big store described even by Emil Zola in his novel The Ladies' Paradise (There's a bunch of mistakes but I learned a lot) Edited by Sunja on 17 March 2012 at 8:11pm 1 person has voted this message useful |
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