leosmith
Senior Member
United States
Joined 6555 days ago
2365 posts - 3804 votes 
Speaks: English*
Studies: Tagalog
| Message 105 of 122 30 December 2010 at 1:56am | IP Logged |
Splog wrote:
I have seen others making similar claims. It seems to me that they are confusing two
concepts: "positive attitude" and "wishful thinking". |
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I guess I owe you an apology then, because when I saw his post I thought of your video (the one where you say
enjoying learning makes it seem like the hours aren't piling up, or something like that).
1 person has voted this message useful
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reineke
Senior Member
United States
https://learnalangua
Joined 6452 days ago
851 posts - 1008 votes
Studies: German
| Message 106 of 122 04 January 2011 at 4:21am | IP Logged |
“It is the quality rather than the quantity that matters.” Seneca
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polyglHot
Pentaglot
Senior Member
Norway
Joined 5071 days ago
173 posts - 229 votes
Speaks: Norwegian*, English, German, Spanish, Indonesian
Studies: Russian
| Message 107 of 122 14 January 2011 at 11:51pm | IP Logged |
slucido wrote:
I have been here for a long time and reading a lot of discussions and
arguments about how to learn languages. It has been very useful for me because it has
been a boost to my motivation and I have learned several interesting techniques.
However, my conclusion is the same I got two or three years ago: as long as your method
has input and output, TIME spent with the language (quantity) is the most important
factor.
Several of us want to get native or near native fluency in our target language or
languages. We read and write a lot about different methods and best methods, but why
native speakers are so superior when it comes to understand and speak their own
language? What's their secret? Why are we so good in our native language?
I think it is pretty obvious. It all comes down to the QUANTITY of our native language
we have been exposed to during our life.
If we interact with our native language around 16 hours every day (input plus output),
it means we can accumulate 5,840 hours when we are one years old, 17,520 hours when we
are three years old, 29,200 when we are five years old, 58,400 when we are ten years
old and 116,800 when we are twenty years old.
Do you really want to speak like a twenty years old native speaker with only a little
fraction of this huge amount of exposure?
We can talk endlessly about best or bad methods, but in the long run, the QUANTITY or
AMOUNT of target language you are exposed to will determine your overall progress and
success.
If we think about this and the fact that the main problem with language learning is the
average language learner gives up,I have two conclusions:
1-As long as you have INPUT and OUTPUT the most important factor is TIME= QUANTITY of
exposure.
2-The best method is the method you don't give up. KEEP doing.
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What 1 year old sleeps only 8 hours per day!?
However, I agree with your theory.
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slucido
Bilingual Diglot
Senior Member
Spain
https://goo.gl/126Yv
Joined 6680 days ago
1296 posts - 1781 votes
4 sounds
Speaks: Spanish*, Catalan*
Studies: English
| Message 108 of 122 15 January 2011 at 12:52am | IP Logged |
polyglHot wrote:
What 1 year old sleeps only 8 hours per day!?
However, I agree with your theory.
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My point is that a twenty years old educated native speaker has spent much more than 10,000 hours using his native language in a passive and active way.
Edited by slucido on 15 January 2011 at 12:52am
1 person has voted this message useful
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Matheus
Senior Member
Brazil
Joined 5086 days ago
208 posts - 312 votes
Speaks: Portuguese*
Studies: English, French
| Message 109 of 122 15 January 2011 at 8:19pm | IP Logged |
Gatsby wrote:
Cainntear wrote:
Gatsby wrote:
| "...there ARE a lot of holes in yours..." We can all make mistakes, even in our native languages and even if we are well-educated. |
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I've had this argument before.
"There are" is a peculiarity of the written register, and derives from Latin.
English verb correspondence doesn't work that way in spontaneous speech.
In English we say "It's me", "it's him", "it's us", "it's you", "it's them" (like the French "c'est moi" etc), not "*am me" etc (compare Italian "sono io" and Spanish "soy yo"). We also say "that's me", never "*that am me" and "that's him", never "*that is he" (some older books might use similar constructions, but it is never said in spontaneous speech.
If you look at a spoken corpus, you'll find that "there's" is the most frequent way to express existence for plural as well as singular. In fact, when "there are" appears in the spoken corpus, it usually follows immediately after "there is". People automatically say "there is", but their schooling has taught them it's wrong, so they "correct" it.
Of course, you don't believe any of this, and you're not even going to bother checking before you tell me I'm wrong. Go ahead. |
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Gosh, Cainntear, I'm one of the least argumentative people you're likely to meet. I do apologize if you somehow took offense to my post, but please don't assume you know me, what I believe or what my reaction to your post may be.
Since I assumed this forum is part of the "written register" and not "spontaneous speech," I stand by my correction as being more appropriate in this instance. As a native English speaker (with a degree in English, I might add), 'there's a lot of holes' jars my sensibilities.
Again, my only point was that we all make mistakes. I very much admire all of this forum's non-native English speakers/learners who very bravely come here to express themselves in a foreign language. I don't think we should be criticizing their grammar unless they specifically ask for the assistance. |
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Gatsby I am your fan. I don't have to explain why, this quote explains it all.
2 persons have voted this message useful
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Calico
Newbie
United Kingdom
Joined 5068 days ago
4 posts - 9 votes
Speaks: English*
Studies: Thai, Portuguese
| Message 110 of 122 15 January 2011 at 8:46pm | IP Logged |
WOW I am not new to learning languages but am new to this forum and one thing that strikes me is the argumentative tension in some members, LoL for me learning a language is one of the best journeys a person can ever take.
Back on topic I agree that quantity will get you there providing there's input and output.
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slucido
Bilingual Diglot
Senior Member
Spain
https://goo.gl/126Yv
Joined 6680 days ago
1296 posts - 1781 votes
4 sounds
Speaks: Spanish*, Catalan*
Studies: English
| Message 112 of 122 16 January 2011 at 10:23am | IP Logged |
legoland wrote:
Calico wrote:
WOW I am not new to learning languages but am new to this forum and one thing that strikes me is the argumentative tension in some members, LoL for me learning a language is one of the best journeys a person can ever take.
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You're absolutely right. Cainntear and slucido are famous all over the Universe. |
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Are you talking to me? I didn't know I was famous. Is it possible to make money from this circumstance? I would like to get advice from a good marketer, please. You know that my philosophy is to make the most of my time.
Quote:
To make their fights fair, Cainntear should post in Spanish, he claims native-like fluency, then perhaps slucido's English would be just as good as his Spanish.
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I have done both ways. Writing in my L2 and my sparring partner in his L1 like here and the other way around.
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Language Learning Forum : General discussion
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