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Which SRS software do you use | ||
Tags: Spaced Repetition (SRS) | Software | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies |  | |
| patrickwilken Senior Member Germany radiant-flux.net Joined 4345 days ago 1546 posts - 3200 votes  Studies: German | Message 33 of 44 17 April 2013 at 2:41pm | IP Logged | |||||
It's cool, how people have such different strategies with Anki. Personally, I have turned off the leech function. In my mind if I put a word in Anki I want to learn it, and some cards just take longer than others. I have suspended about 1% of cards (82 out of 7903) over the last ten months, usually because I am having trouble parsing the grammar, and I think it's more effective to suspend the cards until my German is better developed. I have four types of cards: 1. Stand alone words both English-German, and German-English. I don't count a card as known unless I get the gender and plural form correct. I have now internalized both gender/pluralization rules sufficiently that I mostly get these correct without having to learn them (I think this is a direct benefit from learning so many words via Anki). A lot of errors I make in mature cards are to do with gender. I find having the English-German version important to really make these words more active. The aim is to really automatize my knowledge of these words. 2. Grammar rules I have extracted from grammar book when I first started studying. Not sure how useful these have been to date, but I do have a lot of explicit grammar rules now, that I think will be helpful when I get closer to C1 and am more interested in output. 3. Sentences, this used to make up the bulk of the cards I had. Originally I wrote down every sentence in a series of A1 and A2 textbooks (with corresponding words lists). This was very helpful in getting my German up to an intermediate stage. Now I mostly grab sentences off the Kindle when I am reading, sometimes from Email or even Twitter. To be correct I need to understand all the words in the sentence. Generally there is either no answer, or one or two definitions for words I am finding difficult. I sometimes have mature sentences reappear, that I haven't seen for months, and although I know them, I mark them as wrong, so I can see them more, as there is some aspect of the grammar/phrasing that I want to emphasize by seeing a few more times, before their repetitions make them essentially invisible again. 4. What I am doing a lot more now is putting in example phrases for words I don't know from various dictionaries I have. Most commonly from the Oxford German dictionary, but also via the Kindle from the Collins. I find it really helpful for some verbs to have say 10-20 different example phrases to really get a sense of the broader meaning of a word. I agree entirely that learning sentences makes words stick much more easily. I haven't used the cloze feature, though it sounds useful. How long do people generally spend on Anki? Now that I am reading a lot more I generally don't want to spend too much time on Anki, but I still find that about 45 minutes a day is useful. Edited by patrickwilken on 17 April 2013 at 2:51pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4519 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 34 of 44 17 April 2013 at 2:50pm | IP Logged | |||||
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I would like to note here that my cards can be sentences (or usually parts of sentences
consisting of about five words illustrating a grammar point, or an idiom). Some words I take one by one. I have some separate cards that illustrate the use of accusative pronouns in Romanian, for example (there was a whole lesson with sentences like that in Le Roumain), particularly that le, îi, îl come before the verb but -o is tacked on to the end (L-a ars focul, but a ars-o focul, the fire has burnt him/her). In Romanian I include gender by means of adding the article. (Not the gen declensions which are predictable). I only include irregular plurals (vowel alternances are not irregular). If a verb includes an infix I will add that. I don't denote all the forms of irregular verbs (I have separate ways to learn morphology). Edited by tarvos on 17 April 2013 at 2:50pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| patrickwilken Senior Member Germany radiant-flux.net Joined 4345 days ago 1546 posts - 3200 votes Studies: German | Message 35 of 44 17 April 2013 at 2:58pm | IP Logged | |||||
It's interesting that by forcing myself to learn 1000s of nouns, from English to German, I seem to have implicitly learnt many of the rules for both gender and pluralization, which wasn't the initial intention, but is a nice side-effect. I was testing this out with nonsense words the other day with my wife (who is a naive speaker) and we generally agreed on both gender/pluralization. There is no way I could have learnt all the rules explicitly and then been able to apply them meaningfully in real time. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6409 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 36 of 44 17 April 2013 at 3:03pm | IP Logged | |||||
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I delete a lot. But I also don't use the leech function. There are some things I want to see again no matter how many times I get them wrong.
1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4519 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 37 of 44 17 April 2013 at 3:06pm | IP Logged | |||||
I never learned any Russian plurals from the Anki cards and I know how to form all plural forms, maybe with the exception of one or two straggling irregulars that I have not encountered yet. In all cases. The advantage of languages with fusional morphology is that this part is usually very regular and can be predicted. It takes a bit of actual use but I can predict any case in real-time and use it. I only mess up gender in languages where this is not entirely apparent from the ending of the word itself (or it's an irregularity), in which case I learn those exceptions by heart. For example, ending always (with the exception of a soft sign, but even those can be subdivided into a few predictable categories) predicts gender in Russian. In German, gender is much more problematic and many plurals are irregular, in which case it leads to a lot more annotations and other annoying problems. In German my knowledge of gender is thus way lower than it is in Russian, even though Russian has equally many genders, because in Russian this gender is apparent. If I were to produce a German deck I would include entirely different information on the cards. If morphology is so regular I can add a suffix and never go wrong then it is redundant information on an Anki card. In German, I would add all articles to nouns (or use the noun in a context sentence) and if the plural was irregular and could not be predicted then I would add that irregularity to the card. Therefore in Russian if I made a card for "city" I would write город, города (irregular) but I wouldn't do this for a noun like мазохист (as it has a regular -ы plural due to ending in a hard consonant). I spend 5-10 minutes on reviews daily and add cards after having completed a set of lessons the same day (completed two today, will thus add the new and relevant vocabulary for these two lessons today). Edited by tarvos on 17 April 2013 at 3:12pm 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| patrickwilken Senior Member Germany radiant-flux.net Joined 4345 days ago 1546 posts - 3200 votes Studies: German | Message 38 of 44 17 April 2013 at 4:01pm | IP Logged | |||||
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I guess I just have a very different relationship to my Anki deck. If Anki is just a tool for your quickly memorize lots of words, than I can see how deleting cards would make sense. For me it's really my electronic notebook for the language, where every note I have ever made about the language eventually ends up.
In the last 30 days mature cards have only made up less than 5 minutes/day out 40-60 minutes/day for new/young cards so it's hard to think of the easy cards as bothersome. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| tarvos Super Polyglot Winner TAC 2012 Senior Member China likeapolyglot.wordpr Joined 4519 days ago 5310 posts - 9399 votes Speaks: Dutch*, English, Swedish, French, Russian, German, Italian, Norwegian, Mandarin, Romanian, Afrikaans Studies: Greek, Modern Hebrew, Spanish, Portuguese, Czech, Korean, Esperanto, Finnish | Message 39 of 44 17 April 2013 at 4:12pm | IP Logged | |||||
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That is exactly the function ANKI serves. Anki for me is a memorization tool, and it's
a brute force way of chunking through unknown vocabulary and making it your own. It is entirely independent from learning grammar (which I learn piecewise while working through a textbook and doing exercises and memoring quick-and-fast rules to produce the correct grammatical utterances; this can take more or less time; for example in Hebrew my grammar would probably be good but in Breton with all its weird syntax rules and mutations it's abysmal - it is probably green sheet time). I might use Anki to demonstrate the difference between a regular and an "irregular" situation (viz. the example above), but Anki is first and foremost a vocabulary machine and cluttering it with all sorts of annotations and hooplah would make Anki more annoying than it already is. I only include grammatical information where I cannot directly derive this information from the root of the word or from a clear context. (I used different vocabulary techniques for Breton and Swedish). In Swedish I marked all -ett words that did not have an immediately recognisable ending requiring "ett". I also marked irregular plurals. I also marked a few common strong verbs that were not cognate with Dutch or German and thus had to be guessed. In Hebrew I am experimenting with not using any technique at all. I am having okay success so far but I have the weird idea I lack a few verbs here and there. Overall it's not so bad. But I haven't tried speaking it yet. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||
| patrickwilken Senior Member Germany radiant-flux.net Joined 4345 days ago 1546 posts - 3200 votes Studies: German | Message 40 of 44 17 April 2013 at 4:24pm | IP Logged | |||||
I think it can be used in different way depending on what ones needs.
I find Anki very useful for learning and maintaining the brute facts about a language. So I do use it to learn brute grammar facts (e.g., how to decline an adjective preceding a definite article in the dative case or where sound the object pronoun appear in a sentence). It's great at giving you this explicit knowledge. I am not sure how useful this explicit knowledge is for becoming automatically fluent in a language. I suspect that that comes much more from lots of exposure (reading/listening) and actual use. The grammar cards I have make up on a relatively small part of my deck though, as there is just so many more words than grammar rules to learn. Edited by patrickwilken on 17 April 2013 at 4:24pm 1 person has voted this message useful |
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