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日本語 and me the next round TAC 2012 Team い | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| g-bod Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5980 days ago 1485 posts - 2002 votes  Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, German | Message 193 of 333 27 August 2012 at 10:07pm | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
Haha I guess I'm just not that inspired by counting pages after all! I'm just trying to give myself smaller goals that are achievable in the short term instead so I don't lose steam as quickly. I'm taking a tactical decision not to worry too much about writing kanji at the moment. As long as my kana and knowledge of very common kanji remain sharp enough for me to take notes as and when I need to, I'm not too bothered about the rest, unless I need a little help distinguishing between similar characters (for which writing seems to be a good solution). I totally need to write more though. My regular practice partner is very helpful at correcting my writing and it is very useful practice. Your reference to Donald Duck has reminded me, I still have a couple of volumes of よつばと to read. That has to be as blissful as extensive reading gets for me right now. By the way, I'm impressed you actually read my last post, it was a monster! 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||||||||
| Takato Tetraglot Senior Member HungaryRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5046 days ago 249 posts - 276 votes Speaks: Hungarian*, EnglishB2, GermanB2, Japanese | Message 194 of 333 28 August 2012 at 12:27am | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
Do you make kanji errors like writing 爱 instead of 愛, I wonder? 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||||||||
| g-bod Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5980 days ago 1485 posts - 2002 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, German | Message 195 of 333 28 August 2012 at 12:44am | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
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If you are talking about handwriting, I only write the kanji I know how to write, so I use fewer kanji but make fewer mistakes. If I write using a PC IME I use more kanji, but sometimes make stupid mistakes with homophones, usually through carelessness.
As for the example you gave, I don't recognise the character 爱. It's not on the offline dictionary on my phone and I can't seem to access jisho to check. In the case of 愛, to be honest I would struggle to remember how to reproduce it by hand. I'd hope I could use it correctly when writing with a computer however. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||||||||
| kraemder Senior Member United StatesRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5182 days ago 1497 posts - 1648 votes Speaks: English* Studies: German, Spanish, Japanese | Message 196 of 333 28 August 2012 at 1:14am | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
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I don't recognize that kanji either. It's not in midori. Is it a honest to god authentic Chinese character? Heh. I
cold see him making the point that ou make small mistakes on the kanjis while writing maybe. 愛 is one of my personal favorite kanjis - I just think it looks cool so I've learned to write it pretty well (but my kanji never look as good as when Japanese people write them!) From my experience with German I did a lot of reading and and didn't lookup words so much. I think I reached a point where I stopped learning words rough through sheer repetition because I learned all the more common words. I didn't try to take it to the next level which I think would mean using flashcards if not spaced repetition. I'm pretty ok with that. I just enjoyed reading and watching movies in the language. If I went back to it I for real I suppose I'd try to force more vocabulary though. You can look at my log but I've shunned spaced repetition in favor of just leitner. No due dates heh. No guilt either. It's more fun. But maybe not as effective. 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||||||||
| g-bod Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5980 days ago 1485 posts - 2002 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, German | Message 197 of 333 28 August 2012 at 1:28am | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
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Well if you measure effectiveness as return for time on task, I'm not sure SRS is all that effective either. If you're regularly adding 20+ cards a day, over time the review time mounts up. It certainly seems the 'safest' approach if you have to guarantee memorization of something, but you end up clocking up a lot of time that could be spent on other things.
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| Takato Tetraglot Senior Member HungaryRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5046 days ago 249 posts - 276 votes Speaks: Hungarian*, EnglishB2, GermanB2, Japanese | Message 198 of 333 28 August 2012 at 3:23am | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
That's what came to mind reading your blog:
SRS forces one to remember everything. Why remember stuff that comes up almost never? Why not meet Japanese stuff in a variety of topics instead? Sounds better to me... Common approach only means that an average folk (e.g. not an outstandingly successful, clever or what not person) thinks that it's the right way to do.
If you really want to use Anki I suggest you click for greater periods of time than you'd usually do (say, choosing to come up in 4 days instead of 1), at least by new cards because one's memory is much better than one'd think, at least that's the case with me (and you could probably call me perfectionist, if you want, even though I lost some of my abilities regarding how to achieve stuff). You could choose to be perfect not in remembering everything but in doing stuff the funnest way to do, so generally enjoying life to its fullest possible, being able to say that you had the most perfect life you could make out of it. For me, learning new stuff while doing stuff I generally enjoy (say, learning new characters, words and idioms from the subs of anime) is more enjoyable than learning by using Anki. (I don't know how you do, but I first only wrote the characters, then when I felt I could write most of them, I tried to remember them and what not.) Perfectionism be sicky? Well, it seems like a valuable sickness then. (Although I don't know if you meant that the Anki kind of perfectionism be sicky or perfectionism in general.)
According to my insight, Anki can be completely avoided, no matter what the language is and what not. Just think of 100 years ago. Or, for a modern non-usage with great success, just think of Repiphany (an IRC guy having learned kanji by looking them up in a dictionary).
You need to try to use them in proper grown-up sentences in order to be able to use them in proper grown-up sentences. Just think of the many Chinese people being able to understand Mandarin with ease, but being practically unable to use Mandarin.
It sounds really intriguing to me! Seems a bit like Pimsleur. The fact that I could learn 3 language books for that money is turning me off, though... And ordering from Amazon is a great waste of money on shipping... Do you happen to have some ideas regarding how to solve it? I would be really pleased to try Assimil once... Maybe I'll ony be able to try it when I have a good job, hmm.
Sorry for not being clear, 爱 is the honest to easy writing (e.g. simplified) version of 愛, used in Mainland China. And yeah, you found out my point. I wouldn't think spaced repetition, making notes or anything like that necessary for taking your German to the next level. I particularly consider reading some German high school books being the necessary step. At least I acquired most of my advanced Hungarian through the textbooks I read (sorry for having watched little TV and almost no advanced non-school-textbook literature through my life). I say you should read high school textbooks for the reason that they contain more or less everything learned in primary school that's needed for advanced lingual knowledge, but with a nice compressed feature (or is high school just relearning stuff with a slightly different point of view, I wonder). Edited by Takato on 28 August 2012 at 3:36am 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||||||||
| g-bod Diglot Senior Member United KingdomRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5980 days ago 1485 posts - 2002 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, German | Message 199 of 333 28 August 2012 at 9:49am | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
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Assimil is nothing like Pimsleur. It actually explains grammar and usage and covers a lot more vocab. It is more useful for me right now than struggling through a native book I can barely understand. I can learn more from half an hour with Assimil than I can from half an hour with Harry Potter at my present level. I bought my copy from Book Depository as they do free shipping to the UK.
And yeah, having a job is great for being able to afford stuff but the trade off is you have much less time to use the stuff in! 1 person has voted this message useful | ||||||||||||||||||
| montmorency Diglot Senior Member United Kingdom Joined 4826 days ago 2371 posts - 3676 votes Speaks: English*, German Studies: Danish, Welsh | Message 200 of 333 28 August 2012 at 2:51pm | IP Logged | |||||||||||||||||
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@G-Bod: Do you mean you bought Assimil from the Book Depository? (or Harry Potter?).
And is this for Japanese or German (and what is the base language?). Thanks, and sorry to interrupt the flow. 1 person has voted this message useful |
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