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Harry Potter in French, German, Japanese | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
| TixhiiDon Tetraglot Senior Member Japan Joined 5263 days ago 772 posts - 1474 votes  Speaks: English*, Japanese, German, Russian Studies: Georgian | Message 49 of 72 03 January 2010 at 11:56pm | IP Logged | ||
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Sunja, this blog is fascinating! Thanks for taking the time to write down your observations. I've learned a few new Japanese words from it.
One thing that may be interesting for you to consider when reading the Japanese version is the use of feminine/masculine language. For example, お黙り is very feminine. It would never be used by men, although I've heard gay Japanese men use it as a kind of "camp Japanese". On the other hand, おまえ is very masculine, and is not usually used by women. This seems to be changing slightly though as younger Japanese women reject gender stereotypes. As Captain Haddock says, regardless of who uses it, it is very rough and you must never use it in polite conversation! Edited by TixhiiDon on 03 January 2010 at 11:59pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Sunja Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 5884 days ago 2020 posts - 2295 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Mandarin | Message 50 of 72 04 January 2010 at 9:59am | IP Logged | ||
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hi tixhiiDon!
Thanks for the tip, I need the help. Gender differences don't occur in the other two languages and if I didn't have you guys point them out for me I'd probably be likely to overlook them. ^^ (I don't have any other reading experience other than HP). I thought about trying manga again but I get more words for my money when I go with books, he-he. There aren't as many women characters, so I guess Aunt Petunia is the only one I'll seen using お黙り. I'm still reading Hagrid and he uses おまえ, おまえさん, depending on the mood of his speech. It's very interesting! I decided to finish reading le gardien des clés last night. I'm a chapter behind in French because I've been working on getting my first-year grammar down. Funny, the text is becoming more frustrating now that I've been studying grammar! Suddenly French is not as much fun to read. I guess that means I'm paying more attention to patterns. The main thing is that I make connections on a regular basis -- then it will all start to come together like a puzzle. 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Sunja Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 5884 days ago 2020 posts - 2295 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Mandarin | Message 51 of 72 06 January 2010 at 12:24am | IP Logged | ||
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I will try to make this quick because I want to get back to my Yabla French video watching...
The passage where everyone spots Harry for the first time in the Leaky Cauldron (or whatever the English is for "Tropfenden Kessel") mit einem Schlag mucksmäuschenstil -- what looks to be a mouthful actually means, "all the sudden as quiet as a mouse" -- Mucks (=sound), Mäuschen (=tiny mouse) 水を打ったように静かになった soudain, les clients du Chaudron Baveur ne dirent plus un mot, ne firent plus un geste (I was a bit disappointed that there wasn't an equally colorful phrase in French for "completely silent") I translate the next passage as "how the Muggels get by without magic is beyond me" Keine Ahnung, wie die Muggels zurechtkommen ohne Zauberei. zurechtkommen - get by, do alright マグルの連中は魔法なしでよくやっていける もんだ ~がなくてはやっていけない this is just a variation and means "can't do without __" Je ne sais pas comment font les Moldus sans la magie comment font ... sans .... - how (they) do without The next one describes Prof. Quirrel: Armer Kerl - Poor guy genialer Kopf - genius 哀れな物よ - I have "pathetic" for 哀 秀才なんだが - what a prodigy Le pauvre C'est un esprit remarkable I love this next word, "verschmitzt", which doesn't translate into English very well. It basically means Hagrid couldn't help smiling when he saw Harry completely awestruck at the sight of Daigon Alley. Harrys verblüffter Blick ließ ihn verschmitzt lächeln ハリーが驚いているのを見て、ハグリッドが ニコーッと笑った If I interpret Japanese phonolgy correctly, ニコニコ (smile) has been cut off (non-voiced) for emphasis. La stupéfaction de Harry le fit sourire. The stupified look on Harry's face made him smile. stupified -- I love finding English words in the French language, esp. when I haven't seen them in a while! This is the last one. I discovered a really cool word in Japanese: 四方八方 いろんな物を一度に見ようと、四方八方キョ ロキョロしながら横丁を歩いた in order to see everything at once, he walked the alley looking in all directions Er drehte den Kopf in alle Himmelsrichtungen, während sie die Straße entlanggingen, und versuchte, alles auf einmal zu sehen. il regardait de tous côtés, en essayant de tour voir à la fois.. Edited by Sunja on 09 January 2010 at 12:04pm 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Captain Haddock Diglot Senior Member Japan kanjicabinet.tumblr. Joined 6567 days ago 2282 posts - 2814 votes Speaks: English*, Japanese Studies: French, Korean, Ancient Greek | Message 52 of 72 06 January 2010 at 1:24pm | IP Logged | ||
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哀れ is more like sad or pitiable.
ニコット — Doubled mimetic/onomatopoeic terms (ニコニコ in this case) often have an alternate form that ends in りと or っと and loses the doubling. The difference is as follows: にこにこ = grin continuously にこっと = grin once (flash a grin) 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||
| Sunja Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 5884 days ago 2020 posts - 2295 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Mandarin | Message 53 of 72 06 January 2010 at 2:48pm | IP Logged | ||
wow, that's something I didn't know. I think I got confused when I saw the ッ , っ and equated "grin" with an expression like はやっ! or マジッ! or あつっ! Sort of a way to show emphasis.. Obviously that's not the case! Thanks! Edited by Sunja on 06 January 2010 at 2:56pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Yukamina Senior Member Canada Joined 6063 days ago 281 posts - 332 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Japanese, Korean, French | Message 54 of 72 07 January 2010 at 8:45pm | IP Logged | ||
マグルの連中は魔法なしでよくやっていける もんだ is this the whole sentence? It looks like you've changed もん（もの） to もんだい It doesn't say "get by without a problem", just "get by well". 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Sunja Diglot Senior Member Germany Joined 5884 days ago 2020 posts - 2295 votes 1 sounds Speaks: English*, German Studies: French, Mandarin | Message 55 of 72 08 January 2010 at 11:40am | IP Logged | ||
yep, that's a Hagrid quote for you! (I checked it and that's indeed it) I'm able to understand him as long as I have my "crutches" - German and French. I took it as the typical "everything is reversed" sentence, which I've learned to recognize because I have such a problem with Japanese dependent clauses. Main sentence: It's a problem. もんだいだ or better maybe -- "I question it". dependent clause: the muggels getting by okay without magic マグルの連中は魔法なしでよくやっていける I don't always hit the nail on the head when it comes to translating all the words and phrases that I cross-reference. I just don't have the word experience -- YET ^^ Edited by Sunja on 08 January 2010 at 12:08pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Yukamina Senior Member Canada Joined 6063 days ago 281 posts - 332 votes Speaks: English* Studies: Japanese, Korean, French | Message 56 of 72 08 January 2010 at 2:45pm | IP Logged | ||
I'm saying he's not saying もんだいだ, he's just saying plain old もん(もの)だ. The word 'problem' is not in the sentence at all. He's just showing admiration for muggles getting by without magic. Here's the grammar for ものだ:
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