|
 |
How much time studying vocabulary? | ||
Tags: Time to learn | Vocabulary learning | ||
Share with:
| ||
 Language Learning Forum : Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies |  | |
| rdearman Senior Member United Kingdom rdearman.orgRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5028 days ago 881 posts - 1812 votes  Speaks: English* Studies: Italian, French, Mandarin | Message 57 of 350 30 April 2015 at 2:21am | IP Logged | ||||||||
I did a quick test of this system. I created a spreadsheet with 6 columns which are: Column A: Date input Word Column B: Next date to do: =IF(ISBLANK(F1),TODAY(),A1+5): If F1 is empty, then put today, otherwise 5 days from now. Column C: Word to learn Column D: Translation: I would hide this in the spreadsheet so I couldn't see the answers. But is that how SMALLWHITE does it???? Column D: Type of word, adj, noun, etc. Column F: Type your answer here. There is conditional formatting on the cell, if it matches the word in Column D it is green, it it doesn't match it is red. 
It is a fairly trivial example, but it seems a very effective method. If I were to put this on Google Docs then I could do it anywhere. Nice. It could use more work, but you could just copy the next due date on anything which you got wrong. Or do a mass copy of things which are wrong onto another sheet. I cannot remember how to do this at the moment, but I know it can be done. 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| smallwhite Pentaglot Senior Member Australia Joined 5100 days ago 537 posts - 1045 votes Speaks: Cantonese*, English, Mandarin, French, Spanish | Message 58 of 350 30 April 2015 at 3:26am | IP Logged | ||||||||
You mean you would hide column C, the answer. Smallwhite gives these cells a background colour same as the text colour, such that she cannot see the text even when it's right in front of her. When during her reps she does want to see the answer, she highlights the cell. Sometimes she just pushes the column off the far left of the screen.
Something easily glimpsable, yes, and maybe easily sortable as well. If you do decide to use conditional background colour formatting, you don't really need to green it when the answer is correct. The red-on-error is enough, me thinks.
That's good to hear :) Edited by smallwhite on 30 April 2015 at 3:37am 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Serpent Octoglot Senior Member Russian Federation serpent-849.livejour Joined 6389 days ago 9753 posts - 15779 votes 4 sounds Speaks: Russian*, English, FinnishC1, Latin, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese Studies: Danish, Romanian, Polish, Belarusian, Ukrainian, Croatian, Slovenian, Catalan, Czech, Galician, Dutch, Swedish | Message 59 of 350 30 April 2015 at 4:14am | IP Logged | ||||||||
That's why I do this only with sentences I want to see again and again. My whole deck for all languages is less than 2000 cards. and this includes the suspended ones. I think the main strength of your method is that after a year you have not only a great comprehension, but also a big active vocabulary and accurate grammar. I don't care about gaining these fast unless I'm going to L2 country soon. And let's face it, as a French speaker learning Spanish, you'd not be forced to read kids' books for a year anyway. (I also generally don't like them, apart from the Moomins and occasional other stuff) I have no deadline and I'm my own boss in language learning. My way is clearly more efficient for me, and I don't expect it to be more efficient for everyone else. 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| smallwhite Pentaglot Senior Member Australia Joined 5100 days ago 537 posts - 1045 votes Speaks: Cantonese*, English, Mandarin, French, Spanish | Message 60 of 350 30 April 2015 at 5:20am | IP Logged | ||||||||
|
I suddenly remembered how it all started for me, why I wanted to answer cards lightning fast, in like 2 seconds. I do active/production cards, and I wanted the process to act as output practice, as preparation for speech. I gathered that if I could answer cards faster, I'd be able to speak faster, aka more fluently. If I could utter a word within 2 seconds of a prompt, a sentence of 10 words should take me no more than 20 seconds.
And it did work. I had done hardly any output practice before my first language exchange, 3.6 months into my Spanish journey, yet the first time I did it, I was already text-chatting smoothly (on Skype). I still remember clearly that I was typing at a constant speed, though it wasn't fast. Typing a 10-word response was pretty much like answering 10 cards for me, only that I didn't have to hit 'Enter' between each word. I also noticed that when later I became able to speak, my words tended to come out at a constant speed, too (albeit slowly). Other learners I see in videos tend to speak in clusters with pauses in-between. I do the same in French which I didn't SRS. But I don't make significant pauses in Spanish. So I wanted SRS to train my reflexes. Edited by smallwhite on 30 April 2015 at 5:32am 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| chaotic_thought Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 3334 days ago 129 posts - 274 votes Speaks: English*, German Studies: Dutch, French | Message 61 of 350 30 April 2015 at 8:08am | IP Logged | ||||||||
Ideally you wouldn't have to review vocabulary at all using lists or flashcards. For example, here is a representation of a passage that I read recently which contained a new word X in my target language: ... .... .... .. ... ... .. .... X ... .. .. .... .... .... .. . .. ... ..... .... ...... .... ....... ..... ..... After I read that passage, I "knew" what word X means. I could put the word into my flashcard deck to make sure I don't forget it, but let's assume I don't do that. And let's assume that after 30 days, the knowledge of X has completely faded from my memory. In this situation it means exactly one of the following statements is true: 1. I'm not reading enough in my target language (If I had been reading enough, I should be encountering the important words over and over). 2. I am reading enough but word X just doesn't come up in normal reading (i.e. X ain't that important!)
I wouldn't say that drilling single-word cards can't work, but when we talk about learning efficiency we have to also consider "effectiveness" and enjoyment at that. For example, when I read one text in my target language (20000 Meilen Onder Zee in Dutch translation), I believe I learned a lot of words from that, but most important is I had fun doing this activity. How much effort does it take? 30 hours: 15 hours to listen to the Dutch recording while reading the English translation and 15 more hours to re-listen while reading the Dutch text. I usually did ~1 hr per day on this, but sometimes more/less. So with this schedule you're done with 2 passes in one month. Let's suppose that instead of spending those 30 hours listening to an interesting story with new words in it, that instead I spent 1 hour per day for a month in front of Anki drilling random words and their translations. Would I learn the same amount from doing it? How long would I be able to retain what I learned from this month of flashcard-drilling? Would flashcard drilling help me with my listening skills or grammar the way reading a well-written literary work would? Would drilling vocabuary flashcards for 1 hour per day be as enjoyable as reading a story for one hour per day? (You have to answer this on your own, but I think I know my answer). 3 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| smallwhite Pentaglot Senior Member Australia Joined 5100 days ago 537 posts - 1045 votes Speaks: Cantonese*, English, Mandarin, French, Spanish | Message 62 of 350 30 April 2015 at 9:04am | IP Logged | ||||||||
I noticed this in many posts and it has been a mystery to me: why is READING a given? "I don't need SRS because I re-encounter words when I read" - what if I don't read? Back when I learned French, I did read but not much, because I thought reading was a USE for a language, that one learns a language in order to read. Like how some people only use past exam papers as tests and never as learning tools. Nowadays, I see reading as a learning tool, but still I only read the bare necessary minumum, just as I don't use textbooks beyond what's really necessary. What if we don't take reading as a given? To memorise vocab by SRS vs To memorise vocab by reading and hoping that words come up frequent enough (of course I'm biased ^^). Edited by smallwhite on 30 April 2015 at 9:32am 2 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| chaotic_thought Diglot Senior Member United States Joined 3334 days ago 129 posts - 274 votes Speaks: English*, German Studies: Dutch, French | Message 63 of 350 30 April 2015 at 9:56am | IP Logged | ||||||||
I'm actually saying ideally that reading is SRS. When you read a word X on day 1, you know what it means. If you keep reading, you *should* encounter word X again within N days (notice that N naturally increases as the frequency of the word X decreases) After N days have passed, you'd almost forgotten about word X, but there it is again in your reading! That's what spaced repetition is all about. By the way, if you don't like to read, then the same rule applies for whatever form of natural input you use. Radio, television, attending lectures/classes/tutoring sessions, talking with colleagues, passers-by, friends or whatever. If X doesn't ever come up in a natural setting after 30, 60, 90 days, then you can safely forget about it. 4 persons have voted this message useful | |||||||||
| Ezy Ryder Diglot Senior Member Poland youtube.com/user/Kat Joined 4141 days ago 284 posts - 387 votes Speaks: Polish*, English Studies: Mandarin, Japanese | Message 64 of 350 30 April 2015 at 10:24am | IP Logged | ||||||||
I believe we all have a deadline. "Memento mori." Supposing I have enough time left to learn a language to a satisfying level, even if I manage to get there a mere week earlier than with some other approach, I do get one more week to enjoy the results. As long as I don't burn out in the process, I guess... 2 persons have voted this message useful |
|  | 
Printable version
|
| Copyright 2024 FX Micheloud - All rights reserved No part of this website may be copied by any means without my written authorization. |
