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Chung at work / Chung pri práci

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Chung
Diglot
Senior Member
Joined 5416 days ago

4228 posts - 8254 votes 
20 sounds
Speaks: English*, French
Studies: Polish, Slovak, Uzbek, Turkish, Korean, Finnish

 
 Message 209 of 541
28 November 2012 at 8:11am | IP Logged 
FINNISH

I have finished Chapter 24 of "Kuulostaa hyvältä". The chapter's dialogue has Jutta and Anna looking at pictures and talking about Anna having spent her last Midsummer's on Åland. The chapter introduced the passive active participles for present and past.

***

UKRAINIAN

I finished Unit 11 of "Teach Yourself Ukrainian" (but again still need to do my homework for my Ukrainian class where we're still hammering away at the accusative but this time for adjectives). The unit's dialogues introduced formally the vocative and another use of the preposition за governing accusative in expressions that translate "during" but without the sense of comparing simultaneous actions.

E.g.

За ті роки я працював у Чернігові. "During those years I worked in Chernihov."
Під час зустрічі, вона обідала. "During the meeting, she was eating lunch."

***

OTHER LANGUAGES

It's been a busy week around here and I haven't had any time to study Polish but I did manage to finish the section on direct object for the guide to Uralic languages and I've started to think seriously about starting to learn some Turkish. I hope that this week will be less hectic but with the way things go in my life, I wouldn't hold my breath. *sigh*.

For the direct object in the guide, I've constructed example sentences showing the ways in which the languages in focus mark it. I'm most comfortable with the sentences for Finnish, Northern Saami and Hungarian, but am less so with what I devised for Estonian and Meadow Mari even though the Estonian sentences are quite similar to the Finnish ones.

As with the earlier post soliciting commentary for those sentences demonstrating possession, I'm requesting commentary for the following sentences showing the treatment of the direct object.

ESTONIAN
- Loen raamatut / Olen lugemas raamatut I am reading a/the book.
- Loen raamatu (läbi) I will read a/the book.
- Loen raamatuid / Olen lugemas raamatuid I am reading (some) books.
- Loen raamatud / Loen raamatuid I will read [to completion] (some) books.
- Ma ei loe raamatut I am not reading a/the book.
- Ma ei loe raamatut I will not read [to completion or not] a/the book.
- Ma ei loe raamatuid / Ma ei ole lugemas raamatuid I am not reading (the/some) books.
- Ma ei loe raamatuid I will not read [to completion] (some) books.
- Loe raamat! Read [to completion] a book!
- Loe raamatut! Read [not necessarily to completion] a book!
- Loe raamatud! Read [to completion] the books!
- Loe raamatuid! Read (some) books! / Read [not to completion] the books!
- Ära loe raamatu! Don’t read a/the book!
- Ära loe raamatuid! Don’t read (some/the) books!

- Saadan sind / Olen saatmas sind I am accompanying you.
- Saadan sind I will accompany you.
- Ma ei saada sind / Ma ei ole saatmas sind I am not accompanying you.
- Saada mind! Accompany me!
- Ära saada mind! Don’t accompany me!
- Saadan neid / Olen saatmas neid I am accompanying them.
- Saadan n(em)ad I will accompany them.
- Ma ei saada neid / Ma ei ole saatmas neid I am not accompanying them.
- Saada n(em)ad! Accompany them!
- Ära saada neid! Don’t accompany them!

FINNISH
- Luen kirjaa / Olen lukemassa kirjaa I am reading a/the book.
- Luen kirjan I will read a/the book.
- Luen kirjoja / Olen lukemassa kirjoja I am reading (some) books.
- Luen kirjat / Luen kirjoja I will read [to completion] (some) books
- En lue kirjaa / En ole lukemassa kirjaa I am not reading a/the book.
- En lue kirjaa I will not read [to completion or not] a/the book.
- En lue kirjoja / En ole lukemassa kirjoja I am not reading (the/some) books.
- En lue kirjoja I will not read [to completion] (some) books.
- Lue kirja! Read [to completion] a book!
- Lue kirjaa! Read [not necessarily to completion] a book!
- Lue kirjat! Read [to completion] the books!
- Lue kirjoja! Read (some) books! / Read [not to completion] the books!
- Älä lue kirjaa! Don’t read a/the book!
- Älä lue kirjoja! Don’t read (some/the) books!

- Saatan sinua / Olen saattamassa sinua I am accompanying you.
- Saatan sinut I will accompany you.
- En saata sinua / En ole saattamassa sinua I am not accompanying you.
- Saata minut! Accompany me!
- Älä saata minua! Don’t accompany me!
- Saatan heitä / Olen saattamassa heitä I am accompanying them.
- Saatan heidät I will accompany them.
- En saata heitä / En ole saattamassa heitä I am not accompanying them.
- Saata heidät! Accompany them!
- Älä saata heitä! Don’t accompany them!

NORTHERN SAAMI
- Logan girjji I am reading a book.
- Logan girjji I am reading the book.
- Logan girjjiid I am reading (some) books.
- Logan girjjiid I am reading the books.
- In loga girjji I am not reading a book.
- In loga girjji I am not reading the book.
- In loga girjjiid I am not reading (some) books.
- In loga girjjiid I am not reading the books.
- Loga girjji! Read a book!
- Loga girjji! Read the book!
- Ale loga girjji! Don’t read a book!
- Ale loga girjji! Don’t read the book!
- Loga girjjiid! Read (some) books!
- Loga girjjiid! Read the books!
- Ale loga girjjiid! Don’t read (some) books!
- Ale loga girjjiid! Don’t read the books!

- Mieđuštan du I am accompanying you.
- In mieđuš du I am not accompanying you.
- Mieđuš mu! Accompany me!
- Ale mieđuš mu! Don’t accompany me!
- Mieđuštan sin I am accompanying them.
- In mieđuš sin I am not accompanying them.
- Mieđuš sin! Accompany them!
- Ale mieđuš sin! Don’t accompany them!

MEADOW MARI
- Книгам лудам I am reading a book.
- Книгам лудам I am reading the book.
- Книга-влакым лудам I am reading (some) books.
- Книга-влакым лудам I am reading the books.
- Книгам ом луд I am not reading a book.
- Книгам ом луд I am not reading the book.
- Книга-влакым ом луд I am not reading (some) books.
- Книга-влакым ом луд I am not reading the books.
- Книгам луд! Read a book!
- Книгам луд! Read the book!
- Книгам ит луд! Don’t read a book!
- Книгам ит луд! Don’t read the book!
- Книга-влакым луд! Read (some) books!
- Книга-влакым луд! Read the books!
- Книга-влакым ит луд! Don’t read (some) books!
- Книга-влакым ит луд! Don’t read the books!

- Тыйым ужатем I am accompanying you.
- Тыйым ом ужате I am not accompanying you.
- Мыйым ужате! Accompany me!
- Мыйым ит ужате! Don’t accompany me!
- Нуным ужатем I am accompanying them.
- Нуным ом ужате I am not accompanying them.
- Нуным ужате! Accompany them!
- Нуным ит ужате! Don’t accompany them!

HUNGARIAN
- Könyvet olvasok I am reading a book.
- A könyvet olvasom I am reading the book.
- Könyveket olvasok I am reading (some) books.
- A könyveket olvasom I am reading the books.
- Nem olvasok könyvet I am not reading a book.
- Nem olvasom a könyvet I am not reading the book.
- Nem olvasok könyveket I am not reading (some) books.
- Nem olvasom a könyveket I am not reading the books.
- Olvass egy könyvet! Read a book!
- Olvasd a könyvet! Read the book!
- Ne olvass egy könyvet! Don’t read a book!
- Ne olvasd a könyvet! Don’t read the book!
- Olvass könyveket! Read (some) books!
- Olvasd a könyveket! Read the books!
- Ne olvass könyveket! Don’t read (some) books!
- Ne olvasd a könyveket! Don’t read the books!

- Kísérlek (téged) I am accompanying you.
- Nem kísérlek (téged) I am not accompanying you.
- Kísérj (engem)! Accompany me!
- Ne kísérj (engem)! Don’t accompany me!
- Kísérem (őket) I am accompanying them.
- Nem kísérem (őket) I am not accompanying them.
- Kísérd (őket)! Accompany them!
- Ne kísérd (őket)! Don’t accompany them!

______


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maxval
Pentaglot
Senior Member
Bulgaria
maxval.co.nr
Joined 3333 days ago

852 posts - 1577 votes 
Speaks: Hungarian*, Bulgarian, English, Spanish, Russian
Studies: Latin, Modern Hebrew

 
 Message 210 of 541
28 November 2012 at 8:19am | IP Logged 
Chung wrote:

Nem olvasok könyvet I am not reading a book.


I think the more correct translation is: I don't read any books.
This is the same as "Nem olvasok könyveket".

Chung wrote:

Ne olvass egy könyvet! Don’t read a book!


This is nonsense. If "egy" is an article, then this has no sense. If you say this to
any native speaker, he/she will think "egy" is numeral. Something like: "Ne olvass egy
könyvet! Olvass kettőt!".

Chung wrote:

Ne olvass könyveket! Don’t read (some) books!


I think the more correct translation is: Don't read any books.

Chung wrote:

Kísérem (őket) I am accompanying them.
Nem kísérem (őket) I am not accompanying them.
Kísérd (őket)! Accompany them!
Ne kísérd (őket)! Don’t accompany them!


"Őket" cannot be omitted in these cases if you want a plural object.

Edited by maxval on 28 November 2012 at 8:20am

3 persons have voted this message useful



maxval
Pentaglot
Senior Member
Bulgaria
maxval.co.nr
Joined 3333 days ago

852 posts - 1577 votes 
Speaks: Hungarian*, Bulgarian, English, Spanish, Russian
Studies: Latin, Modern Hebrew

 
 Message 211 of 541
29 November 2012 at 1:49pm | IP Logged 
Something that I forgot in my last comment! There is a possibility to use "Ne olvass egy
könyvet!" - if you add "se": "Ne olvass egy könyvet se!".
3 persons have voted this message useful



Chung
Diglot
Senior Member
Joined 5416 days ago

4228 posts - 8254 votes 
20 sounds
Speaks: English*, French
Studies: Polish, Slovak, Uzbek, Turkish, Korean, Finnish

 
 Message 212 of 541
07 December 2012 at 8:10am | IP Logged 
FINNISH

I have started Chapter 25 of "Kuulostaa hyvältä". The chapter's text is a short piece on Finnish folk songs with lyrics to "Kalliolle, kukkulalle". The chapter introduced use of participles to replace sentences containing subordinate clauses. I've been quite busy again and since my previous entry haven't been able to finish a chapter every week as is my habit.

***

POLISH

I finished Chapter 5 of "Polish in 4 weeks - II". The main topic for grammar was using verbs associated with financial services (e.g. wczytywać ~ wczytać "to read in / swipe (e.g. a card in a reader)", przelewać ~ przelać "to transfer (e.g. funds)")

***

UKRAINIAN

I finished Unit 12 of "Teach Yourself Ukrainian". The unit's dialogues showed examples of using the demonstrative pronouns and their attendant inflections, while the notes described in greater detail the alternations of letters as observed in inflection.

E.g.

Стіл - великий. "The table is big"
Я бачу стіл. "I see a table"
Я не бачу стола. "I don't see a(ny) table"

***

OTHER LANGUAGES

I've managed to start forming the section on imperative for the guide to Uralic languages and recently have decided to begin studying Turkish in the new year. Over the next couple of weeks I'll come up with a clearer idea of how I'll be studying languages in at least the first part of 2013, as well as my membership in any study team.

I'll also have to check those sections for direct object and check in with joshkaasik and some Finns about the examples of direct object in Estonian and Finnish respectively.

______


1 person has voted this message useful



Theodisce
Octoglot
Senior Member
Poland
Joined 4146 days ago

127 posts - 167 votes 
Speaks: Polish*, Latin, Ancient Greek, Russian, Czech, French, English, German
Studies: Italian, Spanish, Slovak, Ukrainian, Serbo-Croatian, Greek, Portuguese

 
 Message 213 of 541
15 December 2012 at 4:14pm | IP Logged 
Chung, I assume you've chosen to stick to TY Ukrainian and the class you are taking, but have you considered reading or listening to authentic material (Wikipedia, radio etc.) at this stage of your learning?
1 person has voted this message useful



Chung
Diglot
Senior Member
Joined 5416 days ago

4228 posts - 8254 votes 
20 sounds
Speaks: English*, French
Studies: Polish, Slovak, Uzbek, Turkish, Korean, Finnish

 
 Message 214 of 541
15 December 2012 at 4:20pm | IP Logged 
I'm starting to think of easing myself into taking a bit of authentic material over the next few weeks (I expect to finish TY Ukrainian by the middle of January). At this stage I'd stick with short and sometimes easy stuff because of my focus on Finnish (and the impending start in Turkish). Kids' books, short articles from Wikipedia or short clips on Youtube would be good. Do you have any pointers, Theodisce?
1 person has voted this message useful



Theodisce
Octoglot
Senior Member
Poland
Joined 4146 days ago

127 posts - 167 votes 
Speaks: Polish*, Latin, Ancient Greek, Russian, Czech, French, English, German
Studies: Italian, Spanish, Slovak, Ukrainian, Serbo-Croatian, Greek, Portuguese

 
 Message 215 of 541
16 December 2012 at 10:03am | IP Logged 
You may find some shorter podcasts (news services etc.) at http://www.nrcu.gov.ua/ua/, just open Архів передач of whichever channel you want. At http://zaxid.net/ you'll find interesting articles and short videos showing the Galician perspective on Ukrainian reality. Lastly, although the essays of Mykola Ryabchuk gathered in his book "From Little Russia to Ukraine" are anything but short you may still find them interesting (http://exlibris.org.ua/riabczuk/index.html).
1 person has voted this message useful



Chung
Diglot
Senior Member
Joined 5416 days ago

4228 posts - 8254 votes 
20 sounds
Speaks: English*, French
Studies: Polish, Slovak, Uzbek, Turkish, Korean, Finnish

 
 Message 216 of 541
16 December 2012 at 9:36pm | IP Logged 
Theodisce wrote:
You may find some shorter podcasts (news services etc.) at http://www.nrcu.gov.ua/ua/, just open Архів передач of whichever channel you want. At http://zaxid.net/ you'll find interesting articles and short videos showing the Galician perspective on Ukrainian reality. Lastly, although the essays of Mykola Ryabchuk gathered in his book "From Little Russia to Ukraine" are anything but short you may still find them interesting (http://exlibris.org.ua/riabczuk/index.html).


Дуже дякую!


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