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Listening-Reading system

 Language Learning Forum : Learning Techniques, Methods & Strategies (Topic Closed Topic Closed) Post Reply
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FSI
Senior Member
United States
Joined 4519 days ago

550 posts - 590 votes 
Speaks: English*

 
 Message 305 of 489
11 October 2007 at 6:11am | IP Logged 
kinoko, I agree with you on the L1 translation. I've stopped using those myself. Now, I'm simply doing everything in the L2. Originally, I'd alternate between the L1 and L2 several times, but I eventually figured I was at a level where I'd benefit most from reading lots of texts completely in the L2 rather than in reading a few texts repeatedly in both languages. So far, so good.
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slucido
Bilingual Diglot
Senior Member
Spain
https://goo.gl/126Yv
Joined 4835 days ago

1296 posts - 1781 votes 
4 sounds
Speaks: Spanish*, Catalan*
Studies: English

 
 Message 306 of 489
11 October 2007 at 6:24am | IP Logged 
A step that lacks the original method is listening L2 without reading. I think I need this step.
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kinoko
Tetraglot
Senior Member
Japan
Joined 4796 days ago

103 posts - 109 votes 
Speaks: Italian*, English, Japanese, Spanish
Studies: German

 
 Message 307 of 489
11 October 2007 at 6:32am | IP Logged 
Yes. Listen without reading first 2 or 3 times if necessary, then read, then listen while reading, then listen again without reading. Once you go through this process and you understand something you hadn't understood the first time you have really improved your listening and your vocabulary as well. For obvious reasons it's not possible to do that with a novel, too time consuming. But that's my method with the news of which I have both the broadcast and the scripts. It helped me tremendously to learn to understand one of the most difficult aspects of the language (really dense and difficult vocabulary spoken at a very high speed without knowing the context and without any intonation)
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FSI
Senior Member
United States
Joined 4519 days ago

550 posts - 590 votes 
Speaks: English*

 
 Message 308 of 489
11 October 2007 at 6:55am | IP Logged 
One thing I find amusing is the nagging chant of "stick to the rules" or "you're not doing it exactly as prescribed" etc. I find it funny because the people who took sio's form of listen-reading, found it impractical, and tweaked it to suit their own methods are the people who have made considerable progress over the months since the thread's inception. In the meantime, the people who haven't tried the method (in any form) yet imply others haven't really tried it either because they didn't unblinkingly follow the original template off a cliff are the ones who haven't gotten any results. It reminds me greatly of other threads where people go on for pages trying to find the "perfect" method for X language, yet spend very little time actually trying any methods on their own, or (gasp!) learning the language. Six months down the line, the folks who found their own methods of L-Ring will continue to learn the language. Good luck to those who think learning doesn't occur unless you try to follow someone else's plan tailored to someone else's personality at the expense of your own :^)

Anyway, my original take on listen-reading was to go back and forth between the L1 and the L2 text while *always* listening to the L2 audiobook until I could easily understand the text in either language. From there, I started shadowing the L2 text while reading it and simultaneously listening to the L2. I always did this with novels, and I always did this with entire books at a time - these were "sweeps" as I've described them earlier. I made a lot of progress with this method; now I can pretty much read anything in Spanish or French on sight, with the only issues arising from vocabulary. Audio comprehension is great, I'm a much better writer, etc...but I couldn't stand doing so many repetitions. So I took a break from the method, thought it over a bit, and came back to it with a different approach. Now I start with the L2 text, listen to the L2 audio (simultaneously, of course), and move on to the next book. If I wish to practice oral production, I may do a sweep with all three parts - listening, shadowing, and reading.

So far, this method's shaping up well; I listened and read the first HP book in French earlier this month, and now I'm listening, reading, and shadowing the book in Spanish after locating an audiobook for it on the internet. As I said on a different thread, instead of many sweeps with a few books, my approach has now changed to few sweeps with many books. I basically want to expose myself to a wider variety of structures and vocab while maintaining a high level of interest. This doesn't mean I'll never use an L1 text again; I very well might. But as long as I can understand what I'm reading in the L2, I'd rather keep reading instead of switching to the L1. I believe the L1 was essential in my earlier studies, as I simply needed to see how everything fit together. But once the initial "toil" was through, I think everything's faster if kept to the L2. In the end, that's the goal, after all.

However, to touch on my initial point again, listen-reading works best not when you follow my advice, or anyone else's advice, but when you try different things out and figure out what works best for you. I've said this before, but it's always fun to say it again, and note how many people take notice, and how many others find greater pleasure in struggling with other people's methods (and how many people stand on the sidelines and imply the people on the field don't know how to play).

Edited by FSI on 11 October 2007 at 7:12am

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audiolang
Diglot
Senior Member
Romania
Joined 4480 days ago

108 posts - 109 votes 
2 sounds
Speaks: Romanian*, English

 
 Message 309 of 489
11 October 2007 at 7:17am | IP Logged 
I wonder whatever happened to siomotteikiru , the very founder of the L-Ring.
I also thank her for creating the longest thread in the existence of this forum ,if I'm not wrong :)
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Volte
Tetraglot
Senior Member
Switzerland
Joined 4599 days ago

4474 posts - 6724 votes 
Speaks: English*, Esperanto, German, Italian
Studies: French, Finnish, Mandarin, Japanese

 
 Message 310 of 489
11 October 2007 at 7:39am | IP Logged 
audiolang wrote:
I wonder whatever happened to siomotteikiru , the very founder of the L-Ring.
I also thank her for creating the longest thread in the existence of this forum ,if I'm not wrong :)


She was banned, to the best of my knowledge. I personally consider this to have been a poor decision. If anyone wants to get in contact with her, PM me: I have her email address, and I'll ask her for permission to give it to anyone who wants it.

This isn't the longest thread: I think the one on Ziad Fazah is.

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audiolang
Diglot
Senior Member
Romania
Joined 4480 days ago

108 posts - 109 votes 
2 sounds
Speaks: Romanian*, English

 
 Message 311 of 489
11 October 2007 at 8:25am | IP Logged 
There was the danger that this method would get released into the whole world so she was stopped quickly ( this resembles the crucification of Jesus ).
I predict that she's coming back sometimes next year with new forces.
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mjcdchess
Diglot
Groupie
United States
Joined 5107 days ago

46 posts - 48 votes
Speaks: English*, Spanish

 
 Message 312 of 489
11 October 2007 at 9:09am | IP Logged 
It turns out this is an excellent method for learning chess as well. Although not really a language, application of this method has increased my chess strength in the short time I have been doing it.



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