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Portuguese Thread

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Medulin
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 Message 401 of 521
14 October 2012 at 1:36pm | IP Logged 
Siberiano wrote:
Em que caso utiliza-se a preposicão "a", como aquela no espanhol? Não consigo ouvirla na radio, mas lejo "ao este", "ao sul". Em alguns casos oućo o "pra" onde no espanhol dizem "a": muy buen día a ti -> muhito bom dia pra voće.


Ao sul is less direct than no Sul, with no movement-verbs:

Florianópolis fica no Paraná? Não, fica mais ao Sul.
You use no Sul when you know the location: Florianópolis fica no Sul, no estado de Santa Catarina.



In spoken Brazilian Portuguese of many regions, the preposition A is being substituted with
1) PARA (pra in speech), for indirect object and movement
   ''Eu mandei uma carta pra ela''; ''Vou pra Miami''
2) EM for close location (English BY/AT) and movement. some expressions
   ''Beber no volante'' ; ''Estou no seu aguardo''; ''Vou lá em casa'', ''Chegaram em casa''
[in formal written language you would have to use A:
Mandei uma carta a ela, Vou a Miami, Beber ao volante, Estou a seu aguardo, Vou lá a casa, Chegaram a casa, although some of these sound strange, unidiomatic, especially the last three).

---
Spanish A vs Portuguese:
tenerLE miedo A vs ter medo de
comprarLE algo A alguien vs comprar alguma coisa DE alguém (BR) / comprar alguma coisa A alguém (PT)
entrar A vs entrar EM

There are many differences. The spoken Brazilian Portuguese of many regions does not like the preposition A very much, PARA, EM or DE are used instead more often than not. For details, you need a good Dicionário de regência verbal, since with every verb it's different, for example with DEVER both A and PARA are used in informal speech: ''Não devemos nada pra ninguém'' (SPC), but at least in Bahia DEVER NADA A NINGUÉM is more frequent. With FALAR it's always PARA: Eu já havia/tinha falado isso pra ela. With DIZER both can be heard (but PARA is much more common where I lived, in Bahia, and A is preferred mostly by old people, not being important whether they are educated or uneducated, even poor and uneducated old people prefer DIZER A).
    

Edited by Medulin on 14 October 2012 at 1:53pm

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Siberiano
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 Message 402 of 521
14 October 2012 at 3:31pm | IP Logged 
Abrigado, voçê é muhito generoso!
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Flarioca
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 Message 403 of 521
14 October 2012 at 5:10pm | IP Logged 
The spoken language has some dynamics and trends come from all sources. I believe that nowadays music is one of the main carriers of usage change.

For instance, in the very famous song "Chega de Saudade" by Tom Jobim and Vinicius de Moraes, interpreted by Joao Gilberto in this Youtube video, the lyrics starts with "vai minha tristeza e diz a ela". It is impossible to say how many people use "diz a ela/e" thanks to this music, but they exist. There are some new musics (I won't cite any, for they are mostly bad, in my opinion) that use "diga a ela/e" as well.

I agree with Medulin, also believe, and Google search experiment tends to confirm, that "dever/devo/deve nada a ninguém" is more common than "dever/devo/deve nada para ninguém". A not so famous, but very good song, "Amor Barato" by Chico Buarque and Francis Hime, interpreted in this video by Zeca Pagodinho, uses "deve nada a ninguém", for instance.

Edit: Link of "Amor Barato" was wrong.

Edited by Flarioca on 14 October 2012 at 7:31pm

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Siberiano
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 Message 404 of 521
15 October 2012 at 8:05pm | IP Logged 
Alguêm me pode aconselhar um club de idiomas no RJ, na Curitiba ou no SP?

Edited by Siberiano on 15 October 2012 at 8:05pm

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Chris Ford
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 Message 405 of 521
18 October 2012 at 5:15pm | IP Logged 
clau44 wrote:


Espero ter ajudado :)


Muito obrigado Clau, a sua reposta foi muito prestativa. Para explicar minha confusão, as vezes eu não posso reconhecer as diferenças entre o português formal e casual, e por isso estou sempre perguntando sobre coisas que são óbvias para falantes nativos. Obrigado novamente para sua ajuda e seu comentário abrangente!
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languagenerd09
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 Message 406 of 521
18 October 2012 at 10:59pm | IP Logged 
Olá a todos! tenho uma pregunta ... mais uma opinião...

é muito importante ter conhecimento sobre a tua língua-alvo? ... por exemplo - aprendei
como "os brigadeiros"


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fabriciocarraro
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 Message 407 of 521
19 October 2012 at 2:30am | IP Logged 
languagenerd09 wrote:
Olá a todos! tenho uma pregunta ... mais uma opinião...

é muito importante ter conhecimento sobre a tua língua-alvo? ... por exemplo - aprendei
como "os brigadeiros"



Não entendi muito bem sua pergunta...
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languagenerd09
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 Message 408 of 521
19 October 2012 at 5:05pm | IP Logged 
hmm ... é importante descobrir a cultura ao lado do idioma?


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