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Iversen’s Multiconfused Log (see p.1!) | ||
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 Language Learning Forum : Language Learning Log |  | |
 Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6700 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes  Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 1033 of 3959 30 June 2009 at 10:12pm | IP Logged | ||
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Danke schön. Ich darf für eine volle Monat nichts schweres tragen (>2 Kg), aber kann meine Arbeit bald wiederaufnehmen und mich auch rund in der Stadt bewegen - eigentlich merkwürdig, als meine eigene Körper bedeutend mehr wiege als alles was ich potentiell herumtragen könnte - wie Milch und Wörterbucher.
Ich habe eine gute kurze Übersicht der Handlung des Niebelungenliedes gefunden, und ich muß sagen daß ich nicht wenig davon verwirrt wurde. So wird Brünhilde als eine Königin von Island erwähnt, was historisch unmöglich ist - Island war in der Völkerwanderungszeit nicht bevölkert. Es ist auch unerwartet von einem Sächsisch-Dänischen Angriff auf Worms zu hören, - in Worms residierten die Burgunderkönigen Gunther, Gernot und Giselher, während Hagen in Tronje lebte - keine Ahnung wo das lag. Siegfried war der Sohn von Sieglinde und König Sigmund und wuchs in Xanten am Niederrhein auf, - aber erschlug ganz richtig einen Drachen. Er var verliebt in Kriemhilde (anscheinend nicht in Brunhilde) und wurde mit ihr verheiratet. Hagen war derjenige, der den Schatz des Drachen (und später von Siegfried/Kriemhilde) in den Rhein wurf, und... und ... und ... Citat am Ende der Beschreibung des N-liedes: "Hat der Einstieg Sie begeistert? Wollen Sie mehr über das Nibelungenlied erfahren? Die Badische Landesbibliothek in Karlsruhe hat eine im Original handschrifliche Ausgabe des Heldenepos digitalisiert. Ob Hörproben oder Text, auf 380 Internetseiten stehen die 2400 Strophen seit März 2003 komplett zur Verfügung. Meine Güte - daß alles werde ich nicht heute Abend bewältigen können. Edited by Iversen on 30 June 2009 at 11:47pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Crush Tetraglot Senior Member ChinaRegistered users can see my Skype Name Joined 5862 days ago 1622 posts - 2299 votes Speaks: English*, Spanish, Mandarin, Esperanto Studies: Basque | Message 1034 of 3959 01 July 2009 at 1:42am | IP Logged | ||
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singular_they 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6700 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 1035 of 3959 01 July 2009 at 1:53am | IP Logged | ||
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In short, people stretch the limits of English because there is a lacune in the language, namely the lack of a singular non-gendered pronoun that isn't as formal- (or British-)sounding as "one's". This is true for the possessive pronouns, but also for the personal pronouns, where "you" quite illogically has become almost the only accepted standard. No language can be totally logical, and this is a case where English isn't.
EDIT: what I wrote above is in fact wrong. You indicate a simple solution, namely to substitute "one" with "they", - the problem is the use of "one" in a situation where it causes no end of problems. Edited by Iversen on 01 July 2009 at 1:04pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| mado Newbie Italy Joined 5624 days ago 4 posts - 4 votes | Message 1036 of 3959 01 July 2009 at 12:13pm | IP Logged | ||
1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| mado Newbie Italy Joined 5624 days ago 4 posts - 4 votes | Message 1037 of 3959 01 July 2009 at 12:14pm | IP Logged | ||
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D'accordo, forse mi sono fatta fuorviare da
NB: Il passaggio "** EDIT: don't believe these numbers, grazie per l'ospitalità. AMP 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6700 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 1038 of 3959 01 July 2009 at 12:50pm | IP Logged | ||
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IT: Le reviste di diverse lingue che ho comprato (e delle quale comprarei certamente sempre più durante i miei prossimi viaggi) non sono destinate a restare in una caterva qualunque senza essere usate. Anche se le ho già dato una scorsa dopo ogni viaggio ci sono articoli che non mi ricordo, - como per esempio oggi dove nelle "Szienze" di Aprile 2009 (p.30) ho visto che l'efficienza particolare (fino a 95 per cento dell'energia de la luce è transformata) è fatto possibile perché le riccettori si transformani in piccolissime unità di laser che transmettono l'eccitazioni elettroniche in polse coerenti, e non come salti fortuiti da una molecola all'altra.
Il fotosintesi nella sua forma attuale è - malgrado la sua età avanzata - infatti un meccanismo così efficiente che non sia credibile che qualunque altro processo possa superarla. I patetichi protagonisti dell'anti-Darwinismo hanno postulato che sia un segno della intervenzione 'intelligente' (di un dio, certo) che un sistema così complesso può apparire e funzionare quando è composto di subprocessi che ognuno di per sé non sarebbe 'economico' per l'organismo. Ma infatti esistano processi più primitive nelle organismi che vivono in ambienti anaerobe. Il fotosintesi dei pianti verdi (con clorofilla) transforma CO2 e acqua in zucchero, ma ci sono batteri denitrificanti che utilizzano il nitrato (NO3-) come accettore di elettroni riducendolo ad azoto molecolare (N2), e batteri solfato-riduttori (sulfobatteri e clostridia) che ottengono la loro energia per riduzione degli ioni di solfato, e finalmente batteri metanogeni che usano la anidride carbonica (CO2) come accettore di elettroni da parte di microorganismi ciò che porta alla produzione di metano (CH4). Ma la fotosintesi clorofillico è speziale perché produce ossigeno che sarebbe mortale per organismi anaerobe, e se si può eliminare la competizione così pur avendo un processo più efficace si può vincere il mondo - e cioè che si e passato a un certo momento nel precambrico. Abbiamo oggi il quasi monopolio del fotosintesi perché la competizione solo esiste nelle condizione anaerobe più ostili, ma anche più rare. Non possiamo sapere oggi che altre variazioni di fotosintesi esistavano durante il primo tempo dopo la sua invenzione, ma la soluzione più forte ha vinto. Sulla pagina 33 si può leggere che al Max Planck-Institut si è riuscito a estrarre presso di 60% del genoma dei neanderthali. Per noi che studiamo le lingue è interessante che anche i neanderthali possedevano il gene FOXP2, che si crede è responsabile per la coordinazione fisica dei nostri organi fonatorii. Dato che la separazione tra noi e i neanderthali si è avvenuto a circa 800.000 anni fa (e che non ci pare essere avvenuto nessun croccia dopo), è credibile che anche l'invenzione della parola si è avvenuto a più di 800.000 anni fa. Ma non sappiamo di che sorte di lingua si trattava, - così complesso vomo la lingua di Homo Sapiens? .. non si sa. Certo ci sono diferenze nella forma della bocca che favoriscono altre suoni, ma questo è evro anche se si compare uomini e donne o adulti e bambini, e non di meno possono parlare la stessa lingua. Se avevano soppravissuto i neanderthali è probabile che si potrebbero imparare le sue lingue. Ma non sappiamo assolutamente niente sulle sue strutture linguistiche. Grazie a Mado per non più mi credere totalmente anti-italianista. E anche grazie a Mado per richiamare l'attenzione sulla pessima qualità del mio Italiano nel passaggio rilevante (25/6), in modo che io possa ameliorarlo tanto che posso. ----- The magazines about popular science and other things which I buy under my travels aren't going to lie around somewhere without being used. I have read them through, but not every single sentence in them. Now I happened to open the April 09 issue of "Le Scienze" and found an article that gives one more reason for the stupendous efficiency of common photosynthesis: when the electric impulses have to move through the receptors they don't just skip from one molecule to the next, nay the whole things works like an assembly of miniature lasers which transmit the electric excitation through coherent pulses. This just adds one more amazing side to the process known as photo synthesis, and you can now imagine the joy of the pathetic protagonists of the intelligent design (of course through intervention by a god whose own origines are left totally in the dark) - every thing that makes this process more complicated adds to the mystery of how it was established in the first place. And these people thrive on unsolved problems in biology. But in fact there are alternatives to photosynthesis, but they are practically confined to anaerobe environments (i.e. without oxygen). The pecularity of photosynthesis is that it produces oxygen, and if you have a process that both is very efficient AND kill off your competitors then you can take over the world. We have no way of knowing now which variations of photosynthesis competed in the first time after its first occurrence, because it all happened billions of years ago and the winner literally "took it all". A few pages later there is a small article about some results from the German Max Planck-institute. Scientist there have extracted something like 60% net of the total genome of the Neanderthal. It is confirmed that separation roughly took place 800.000 years ago and that there are no signs what so ever of systematic interbreeding since then (maybe interbeedingt happened on an individual base, but this apparently didn't lead to surviving lineages). One of the most important finds was that even the Neanderthals possessed the famed FOXP2 gene, which seems to govern the fine-motoric side of our speech organs. So langue in some form is almost certain to have existed at least 800.000 years ago, - though of course we cannot know whether it was as comlpex as our modern languages. The shape of the mouth and throat of Neanderthals was different from that of Homo sapiens, but even within our own species there are differences in shape between male and females and betwwen adults and small children, but still we use the same languages. If the Neanderthals had survived then it is likely that they would have sounded different from us, but it is almost certain that we could have learnt each other's languages. Edited by Iversen on 01 July 2009 at 1:55pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6700 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 1039 of 3959 01 July 2009 at 8:01pm | IP Logged | ||
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SV: Hurra, jag förstår samiska. Tja, åtminstone ett ord - jag lyssnade till "Oddasaat" - de samiska nyheter på SV2 - och plötsligt sa de "merabotn" - havsbottn. Sveriges Television sender textade nyheter på samiska och finska (respektive Oddasat och Uutiset), och jag såg de första därför att det just hade varit ett utmärkt program om havet (i serien "Jorden - en biografi").
Det började med en liten förklaring av vågornas mekanik, och sedan kom berättelsen om de hundratusentals års regnvädor som fyllt havet i början av prekambrium med vatten som hälften kom från jordens inre, hälften från vattenhaldige meteoritter. Sedan kom en förklaring på havsströmmarne. Det finns ytliga havsströmmar som blandar vatten från alla hav, men även djupa "termohaline" havsströmmar som förar varmt vatten från tropikerna till det arktiska området. Här kyls det, sjunker till bottenen och strömmar tillbaka till tropikerna för genopvärmning. Golfströmmen är en del av detta system. Hvad sker därsom detta system stannar? I Green Lake i Washington (USA) är det från 20 meter ned inte något syre i vattnet, och i stället levar de svavelbakterier som jag nämnde i den italienska texten ovanför och vattnet är mycket giftigt för oss. I slutet av perm stannade havströmmene på grund av den globala uppvärmningen (skälen till detta har jag tidigare nämnt) och alla världshaven blev stillastående og förgiftade. Fastan allt liv dog ut i havet. Och sedan drog parallellen till detta, där det också finns en global uppvärmning, vilket kan påverka de temperaturskillnader som håller havet i rörelse. Vi har inte et superkontinent som i perm, men konsekvenserna kan facktisk bli illa nog om havströmmene blott försvagas afsevärd. --------- Yeah - I know one word in Sami. I was listening to Oddasat - the Sami news in Swedish TV - and suddenly heard "merabotn", and lo and behold it was "sea floor" as I suspected. Swedish TV also have Finnish news with subtitled in Swedish. But I was in fact listening because I had been following a program about the sea, one part of a series called something like "Biography of the Earth". We first heard soemthing about wawes, then something about the origin of the sea, - something with 100.000 years of heavy uninterrupted rain with water that partly came from volcanism, partly from meteorites. This lead to a description of the 'termohaline' current that run through all the oceans, - the Gulfstream is one of these. Without these streams the water get stagnant and oxygen-poor, and then purpur bacteria take over (se the text in Italian above). Their metabolism is based on Sulphur, and the stagnant water - as demonstrated by Green Lake in Washington state - will be full of HSO, which is heavily poisonous for beings like us. This happened at a global scale at the end of the Permian, and almost all life in the sea died out. And as expected we then returned to the present day where the ongoing global warming also may affect the sea currents - though not at the same scale as in the Permian because we don't have just one single supercontinent. But just a weakening of the currents can be serious enough for us. Edited by Iversen on 01 July 2009 at 8:15pm 1 person has voted this message useful | |||
| Iversen Super Polyglot Moderator Denmark berejst.dk Joined 6700 days ago 9078 posts - 16473 votes Speaks: Danish*, French, English, German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Dutch, Swedish, Esperanto, Romanian, Catalan Studies: Afrikaans, Greek, Norwegian, Russian, Serbian, Icelandic, Latin, Irish, Lowland Scots, Indonesian, Polish, Croatian Personal Language Map | Message 1040 of 3959 01 July 2009 at 8:06pm | IP Logged | ||
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(content moved) Edited by Iversen on 07 June 2010 at 2:28pm 1 person has voted this message useful |
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