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Iversen’s Multiconfused Log (see p.1!)

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Iversen
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 Message 1681 of 3959
09 February 2010 at 11:35pm | IP Logged 
Ich habe bis heute 417 Zoologische Gärten und Aquarien gesehen, und der Zoo von Port-of-Spain in Trinidad wird der nächste!

Esta noite, eu passei uma hora na compania duma revista Portuguêsa chamado Focus, que eu comprei no ano 2007. Mas para ser honesto: não é tão interessante quanto eu esperava. Na frente decia "Ferias à sua medida", e por isso pensei seja uma revista de viagens. Mas não, é um semanario geral. O mais interessante foi a de buscar exemplos gramaticais, como os subjuntivos na passagem seguinte sobre a cantora colombiana Shakira:

"Seja como for, se não fugir muito ao figurino apresentado no concerto londrino na Wembley Arena, a 18 de Março. Shakira subirá ao palco do Atlântico de pés descalços e com vestimenta reduzida, permitindo ao público masculino deleitar-se com o menear das suas generosas ancas quando executar a sensual dança do ventre."

Há também um artigo sobre o chefe da família Bragança, Duarte Pio, que os monarquistas consideram o herdeiro dos reis de Portugal. Há também uma curta, mas muito reveladora nota sobre o presidente Cavaco Silva para não convidar seu antecessor, Mário Soares, ao 50. aniversário do Tratado da UE - ainda que foi Soares quem preparou a entrada Português na UE.

---

I have spent some time tonight reading a magazine named Focus which I bought in Portugal in 2007. On the front page the story line went "Tailormade holidays for you" ('holidays at your mesure'), but it was just a general magazine with a lot of boring stuff about celebrities and politics - in fact I found myself searching for grammatical examples rather than reading for content. For instance I found an amazing collection of futuric subjunctives in the passage quoted above, which I found in an article about the formerly Columbian singer Shakira.

I also found an article about the current head of the family Bragança, whom a few scattered monarchists still see as the legitimate heir to the Portuguese throne. But monarchy is not likely to return to Portugal, - not even when the current Portuguese president is mean enough not to invite his predecessor Mario Soares to the 50 year jubilee of the EU treaty, in flagrant disregard for the fact that it was Soares who paved the way for the entry of Portugal into the EU.


Edited by Iversen on 09 February 2010 at 11:38pm

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Iversen
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 Message 1682 of 3959
10 February 2010 at 1:04am | IP Logged 
I wrote the following rant for a thread about dialectal differences, but then I realized that it didn't quite answer the original question. And then I just dumped it here...


Learning to recognize and understand a certain dialect doesn't have to the result of a conscious study, but learning to express oneself in it does. Without some dedicated effort even a dialect or language you can understand perfeectly will never become active.

Even dialects deserve to be learnt from the bottom up, using the same methods that you would use to learn an full, undisputed language - it just takes less time (provided you can find enough study materials). This is also the way to go to learn closely related languages. It is inevitable at least for me that I will use my skills in one language to set up patterns and to guess at words for no. 2, but in due time no. 2 should and will be 'cleansed'.

However mostly I leave dialects as something that I just can understand through their similarity to something I have learnt in the proper way, but not as something to be learnt. I may have some scattered information that can be used to identify a certain dialect or language, but it is hard to find enough materials about a dialect to learn it properly, unless you happen to live in place where it is spoken on a daily basis. So the solution for me is not to care too much about the ingredients in my personal idiolects - they are bound to be eclectic.

Edited by Iversen on 10 February 2010 at 1:05am

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Hobbema
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 Message 1683 of 3959
10 February 2010 at 5:03pm | IP Logged 
Iversen wrote:

Há também um artigo sobre o chefe da família Bragança, Duarte Pio, que os monarquistas consideram o herdeiro dos reis de Portugal. Há também uma curta, mas muito reveladora nota sobre o presidente Cavaco Silva para não convidar seu antecessor, Mário Soares, ao 50. aniversário do Tratado da UE - ainda que foi Soares quem preparou a entrada Português na UE.

.....

I also found an article about the current head of the family Bragança, whom a few scattered monarchists still see as the legitimate heir to the Portuguese throne. But monarchy is not likely to return to Portugal, - not even when the current Portuguese president is mean enough not to invite his predecessor Mario Soares to the 50 year jubilee of the EU treaty, in flagrant disregard for the fact that it was Soares who paved the way for the entry of Portugal into the EU.


Para o público geral aqui nos Estados Unidos, as monarquias não são bem compreendidos. O ministro primeiro ou o presidente têm o autoridade real, e um rei ou rainha se aparece só um símbolo. Mas, muitos americanos aqui parecem ter uma obsessão com a Família Real Britânica.

Enquanto a Família Real de muitos países europeus é uma parte do seu caráter, se parece também que o nascimento da UE faz todos países menos individual e mais "generic". Eu acho que as Famílias Reais terá um tempo de vida mais difícil desde o nascimento da União Europeia?

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Iversen
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 Message 1684 of 3959
10 February 2010 at 9:54pm | IP Logged 
A União Europeia tem realmente nenhuma importância para a nossa atitude sobre a monarquia. Eu li recentemente que 78% dos dinamarqueses apoiam a nossa rainha Margrethe II, e uma razão podria ser que não temos de ter uma serie de políticos decrepitos na funcião presidencial. Margrethe não só sopravivido, mas geredo bem a sua posição desde 1972 (embora ela fumar como uma chaminé), e o nosso sistema de governo garante que a família real não interfere na política. Não se pode decir a mesma coisa dos politicos.

The EU has no influence on the attitude of the Danes to their monarchy. I recently read that 78% support our queen Margrethe II, who has not only survived, but taken well care of her duties since 1972 (in spite of her smoking like a chimney). In that period we could also have had a row of decrepit and senile politicians sitting for a few years each as presidents. Besides the royal family doesn't interfer into politics, - unfortunately you can't say the same thing about our politicians.

Edited by Iversen on 10 February 2010 at 10:02pm

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unityandoutside
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 Message 1685 of 3959
11 February 2010 at 6:49am | IP Logged 
Hello, I've been following your log for a while now (especially your Russian), and thought I'd make you aware of a book that I've really been enjoying lately. This book is a veritable treasure trove of Russian cultural readings. There are readings on history, literature, arts, and a small section on geography. The material is Soviet era, and so a tad bit dated, but the language great -- written (by experts in the respective fields) in a manner decently accessible while remaining representative of the higher register of the language. Seemed right up your alley, so I figured I'd make you aware of it. It's certainly been a great aid in my studies.

Best of luck in all your studies!
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Iversen
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 Message 1686 of 3959
12 February 2010 at 1:35am | IP Logged 
Thank you. I can see that the book ("Russian Area Reader") is fairly cheap, so I may put into the cart next time I'm buying something through the internet. Right now I use Russian internet texts with an added Google translation, which I mainly use to avoid looking words up all the time.

But in between I also read magazines which I have bought during my travels, and this includes a Portuguese magazine called "Focus".

Nesta revista eu ví um artigo afirmando que os marinheiros Português estavam ainda mais cedo na America do Sul do que se cree normalmente. A ideea não esta nova, - alguns há muito tempo suspeitavam que os Portuguêsos já estavam familiarizados com a posição do Brasil quando eles permitíam que o papa define a fronteira entre as esferas de Espanha e o Portugal no Tratado de Tordesilhas (1494), e que não foi um caso que a costa do Brasil foi localizado dentro da zona Portuguêsa.

A zona Portuguêsa era geralmente na África e Ásia, e o artigo afirma que ainda descobriram a Austrália. A prova seria em parte que alguns mapas velhas francêsas mostram uma grande massa de terra chamada de "Terra Java". Isto e realmente possível. No entanto, o artigo perde tanto a lógica quanto a credibilidade quando afirma que Cristovão Colombo era um espião Português, cuja única intenção com o viajar ao oeste seja a de desviar a atenção dos Espanholes dos acontecimentos no Oriente - se fos vero, sucedeu neste caso um pouco demais bem, pois como se sabe a maioria da América Latina fala agora Espanhol.

The article revives the suspicion that Portugal knew the position of Brazil well before the treaty of Tordesillas, in which the pope basically gave the Spaniards all new lands to the West and to the Portuguese all new discoveries in Africa and Asia. The article also suggests that the Portuguese visited Australia as early as 1519. But it loses some of is credibility and logix when it goes on to claim that Columbus really just was a Portuguese spy who tried to divert the attention of the Spaniards from the Orient with his travels towards the West. If this was true then this tactic proved a dismal failure, because as we all know most of Latin America speaks Spanish today. Sometimes those conspiration theories just miss the point.


Edited by Iversen on 12 February 2010 at 11:33am

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Iversen
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 Message 1687 of 3959
13 February 2010 at 10:05pm | IP Logged 
Today I wanted to visit a town approx. 2½ hours by train from here (Herning), but after 20 minutes the train stopped because of a defect switch ahead. And there we were stuck for almost two full hours. Luckily I had brought my Irish Teach Yourself grammar. But I still don't like it - I wanted to buy a reference grammar and I got a grammar textbook. There is a lot of useful information in it, but it is badly organized, and I find the drills totally out of place in a grammar. When I return from Trinidad I'm goping to order the one from Routledge, - those Routledge guides I already have bought are excellent.

DA: På grund af forsinkelsen kørte jeg ikke helt til Herning, men kun til Silkeborg hvor jeg så to museer. Det ene rummer Tollundmanden, et velbevaret moselig fra jernalderen (3-400 år fvt*). Det andet er et nyt Papirmuseum, hvor man fortæller historien om hvordan byen opstod omkring et papirværk i 1844. Her fortalte guiden osgå om hvordan Hjejlen - verdens ældste stadigt sejlende hjuldamper - kom til byen (der er omgivet af søer). Det sidste stykke blev den trukket over land af 300 papirarbejdere og tilfældigt forbipasserende. På tilbagevejen læste jeg en bog på dansk - men det må tjene til min undskyldning at den er skrevet af et medlem i min rejseklub.

* før vor tidsregning (=før Kristus)

Because of the long delay I didn't have time to go to Herning, but stopped in Silkeborg. Here I visited two museums. In the first the most important item is the bog body known as the Tollund man from the Preroman Iron age (around 3-400 BC). The acids in the bog have colored him pitchblack, but apart from that he is amazingly well preserved. The other museum is fairly new and shows how paper is produced. The town Silkeborg was founded as late as 1844 by a man named Drewsen, who placed a paper factory here because of the lakes the surround the town.   

On the way back to Århus I read a book in Danish, but my excuse must be that it was written by one of my acquaintances from my travel club. It describes her 1 year long ramble in a tiny boat around the Pacific ocean.

---

SP: Esta noche he estado escuchando television de los EE.UU. de América, Inglaterra ('Travel'), Raiuno (Italiana) y Sueca, y en este momento estoy viendo las noticias en TVE en español. Esto es un tipo de programación que es relativamente estandardizado, pero hay tambien entrevistas con gente 'en la calle'. Ahora se discute el problema de las pensionas, y por eso se visita diversas impresas. Pero la gente allí hablan con tanta claridad como los periodistas.   

En este momente se habla de la situación en Haiti - donde se habla un idioma criollo basado en francés, pero hay muchas persona que entrevistar que hablan español pues esto es el idioma del otro pais en la isla Hispaniola, la Republica Dominicana. Se estima que durará una decena de años o mas para reconstruir la ciudad capital Port-au-Prince.

This evening I have been watching TV from several countries, but right now I'm watching Spanish television. First the news, now a program about a naval education. and before that there was something about the situation in Haiti.


Edited by Iversen on 13 February 2010 at 10:22pm

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Fasulye
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 Message 1688 of 3959
14 February 2010 at 6:12pm | IP Logged 
DE: Mein Avatar brauchte etwas Abwechslung! Auf dem neuen Foto sind die großen Ammoniten aus dem Naturkundemuseum in Dortmund zu sehen. Diese hier sind bei Bauarbeiten für die Dortmunder U-Bahn entdeckt und ausgegraben worden. Ammoniten sind zum ersten Mal in der Jurazeit aufgetreten und mit den Dinosauriern am Ende der Kreidezeit (vor 65 Millionen Jahren) ausgestorben. Eigentlich sind es Kopffüßler, die eine Größe von 2 cm bis zu 3 m haben können. Diese hier in Dortmund sind riesengroß, ich schätze mal, dass sie einen Durchmesser von mindestens 2 m haben. Gerade die Ammoniten waren für mich die Objekte, die mich in diesem Museum am meisten beindruckt hatten. Ich hatte davor nur Zeichnungen von ihnen im Paläontologie-Lehrbuch gesehen und war richtig überrascht, dass sie so groß sind.

Fasulye

Edited by Fasulye on 14 February 2010 at 7:59pm



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