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Iversen’s Multiconfused Log (see p.1!)

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tarvos
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 Message 3425 of 3959
04 November 2013 at 2:04pm | IP Logged 
Quote:
However the old Academy Leviathan had one thing which redeems it: it clearly
indicated which verbs had infixes like -esc or -ez, and which didn't. I once started a
project which consisted in transferring this information to my newer and more handy
Teory, but somehow I got stuck midway through the alphabet. I still don't understand
why the dictionary authors don't take this problem as seriously as the gender of nouns.


Why would people even make dictionaries that don't do that if they are translated to
another language? Clearly someone with half a brain would realise a foreigner would use
such a dictionary...

By the way, the only time I check for -ez is if the infinitive ends in -a (-i/î for -
esc). But you already knew that. I've also found that many of the -esc verbs are of
Slavic origin for some reason.
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Iversen
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 Message 3426 of 3959
04 November 2013 at 2:19pm | IP Logged 
tarvos wrote:
the only time I check for -ez is if the infinitive ends in -a (-i/î for -esc).


The problem is that this formulation comprise the majority of the verbs in Romanian, so in in principle you should check just about any verb you use. I have probably raised my rate for successful guesses a lot simply by marking the verbs halfway through the alphabet and reading a lot of Romanian on the internet - but how do you know how many errors you still do when you are in a situation where you don't get any feedback? Maybe a Romanian spell checker could catch those infix errors .. which could be a good reason for finally installing it on my home PC.

Edited by Iversen on 04 November 2013 at 2:19pm

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tarvos
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 Message 3427 of 3959
04 November 2013 at 2:23pm | IP Logged 
Iversen wrote:
tarvos wrote:
the only time I check for -ez is if the infinitive
ends in -a (-i/î for -esc).


The problem is that this formulation comprise the majority of the verbs in Romanian, so
in in principle you should check just about any verb you use. I have probably raised my
rate for successful guesses a lot simply by marking the verbs halfway through the
alphabet and reading a lot of Romanian on the internet - but how do you know how many
errors you still do when you are in a situation where you don't get any feedback? Maybe
a Romanian spell checker could catch those infix errors .. which could be a good reason
for finally installing it on my home PC.


I use the inbuilt spellcheck on my Chrome browser. It basically covers all of my
languages except Icelandic and Breton.

I tend to just guess whether it's one of them or not, but most of the common ones (a
vorbi, a plăti, a iubi, a mulțumi, a porni, etc) are obvious. Same with a funcționa, a
defensa, a aranja, etc
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Iversen
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 Message 3428 of 3959
08 November 2013 at 11:45am | IP Logged 
LAT: Post peregrinationem meam Africam Australem et usque ad heri nocte lingvam non studiebam, id quod mehercle bone non est. Sed non modo libros Harrii Potteris in hibernice lingva habeo (et in Anglice et Graeca antiqua linguisque Slavicis et varia), sed librum II de HP et Camera Secretorum Hogvartensis etiam in lingua Latina, et heri 'noctem latinam' feci. Facilius mihi est Latinam legi quam Hibernicam.

Etiam enumerationem perfeci vocabulorum meorum lingvae latinae, dictionaria dua utens. Cum Langenscheidt Schulwörterbuch (ubi X paginas ex DCCXXXI numeravi) estimationes sequentes obtinui: circa MMMMMMM vocabula aperta (XXXIV centesima), MM vocabula conjecturabila (IX centesima) ex MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM in libro. Cum New College Dictionary (ubi VI paginas ex CDXXI numeravi) proventi fuerunt: circa MMMMMMMM vocabula aperta (XXX centesima), M vocabula conjecturabila (IV centesima) ex MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM. Romani aisne sic numerabila magna ita non scribebant! Secundum Vicipediam "5000" ut V supralineatus scribendus sit, et "10000" quam X cum linea, sed hic in foro HTLALiense istud factu possibile non est, et etiam credo id conventionem medievalem esse. Quomodo fecerunt romani?

Autem enumerationem in nuntio MMCDXXI cum numeris novis iterativi numerabiles 'arabices' (vero indes) utens.

I haven't spent any time on Latin since my trip to Africa, but yesterday evening I decided to do something about it, so I reread several chapters from the second volume of Potter and studied a couple of pages intensively. Actually I have read the whole book through right after I bought it without too big problems (apart from lexical complications like the title of the fourth chapter, in which two words out of four are neologisms). However I also did a couple of wordcounts, and they seem to indicate that my known Latin vocabulary stays firmly below 10.000. Actually the numbers have gone slightly down, but this is probably due to the fact that I now have introduced the category of 'guessable' words, which in 2009 were counted as 'known'. But the short sad story is that my Latin hasn't really progressed the last couple of years, and that's really not OK. I have added the results to the table on the precding page, which I intend to keep updated from now on.

Edited by Iversen on 08 November 2013 at 12:26pm

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Iversen
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 Message 3429 of 3959
10 November 2013 at 10:30pm | IP Logged 
LAT: Matrem meam fine hebdomadis visitavi, et aliqua via inter folias et ramos in pratulo suo per tempestate recente depositos tempus inveni ad aliam computationem verborum latinorum perficere. Dictionarium vetustum ex anno domini MCMLXX uti quod ad matrem olim donavi ut ea solvationem crucigrammata prodesse.

I have been visiting my mother this weekend, and even though the recent storm left some branches and a lot of leaves on her lawn I somehow also got time for a bit of studying. And because the latest vocabulary counts for Latin left me puzzled I did one more, using an old Latin-Danish dictionary from 1970 which she got for her crossword solving.

The results this time: 6000 known words (46%), 500 guessable (5%) and 6500 unknown words (49%) out of an estimated 13.000 words - not much, so the absolute numbers are low, but the percentages are as high as in 2009. I did a further text by subdividing the 10 pages I studied in 2 times five: the first five pages gave 47%, the last five gave 44, so with this dictionary and the standards I have applied the results are fairly consistent. So why the jump upwards since last week? Maybe the words in the smallest dictionary somehow suit me better, but then the results with the two other dictionaries across 2009 and 2013 wouldn't be so different. I could have been less critical in 2009, but I'm sure that I haven't changed my criteria since last week. There is still one possible explanation left, namely that the 'rust' has disappeared since last week, but I wouldn't expect so quick changes in my passive vocabulary in any language in such a short time. Or maybe I have just had a series of fluke results. Ah dunno..

DU: Afgezien van dat, heb ik de meeste van "Colloquial Dutch" dit weekend gelezen, en hoewel ik geen problemen heb gehad om de de tekststukken van do boek te begrijpen, heb ik wat culturele informatie geleerd en ook wat sommige zwakke punten in mijn Nederlandse grammatica gemerkt. Ik ga op een 10-daagse reis naar Nederland om een paar maanden, en tegen die tijd zal mijn Nederlands hopelijk tiptop werken.




Edited by Iversen on 10 November 2013 at 10:32pm

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Josquin
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 Message 3430 of 3959
10 November 2013 at 11:05pm | IP Logged 
Iversen wrote:
LAT: Dictionarium vetustum ex anno domini MCMLXX uti quod ad matrem olim donavi ut ea solvationem crucigrammata prodesse.

I would like to remark that "uti" is a deponent verb which requires the ablative. Furthermore, "donare" as well as "prodesse" require the dative and "ut" calls for a subjunctive. The genitive plural of "gramma" is "grammatum" and I'm pretty sure the target of "prodesse" should be expressed by "ad".

So, the sentence should probably look something like this:

Dictionario vetusto ex anno domini MCMLXX usus sum, quod olim matri donavi, ut ei ad solutionem crucigrammatum prodesset.

Iversen wrote:
... tempus inveni ad aliam computationem verborum latinorum perficere.

There is no such thing as a final infinitive in Latin. A possible solution for this phrase would be using the gerundive:

... tempus inveni ad aliam computationem verborum latinorum perficendam.


PS: This is not intended to be criticism, but rather feedback for your language studies.

Edited by Josquin on 11 November 2013 at 11:23am

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Iversen
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 Message 3431 of 3959
11 November 2013 at 1:43pm | IP Logged 
Very useful feedback indeed. My vocabulary counts had already given some reason for concern about the state of my Latin, and I can see that I need to do some repetition of Latin syntax too.
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tarvos
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 Message 3432 of 3959
11 November 2013 at 1:54pm | IP Logged 
Since we're on the subject, concerning Dutch - the phrasing "om en timme" (as in Swedish)
takes another preposition in Dutch, namely "over" -

"Over een paar maanden ga ik...." etc. Nitpicking, but "om" implies "at" in temporal
context, so you can't mix them up "Om twee uur" is "at 2 o'clock".


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