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Iversen’s Multiconfused Log (see p.1!)

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Iversen
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 Message 2897 of 3959
11 April 2012 at 10:53pm | IP Logged 
GER: Es ist erstaunlich, dass du nicht den archäologischen Park in Xanten besucht hast, der ja zweifelsohne die Hauptattraktion von Xanten ist - und von deinem Standort wenige Kilometer enfernt liegt. Das meiste ist jedoch innerhalb der letzten Jahren gebaut, darunter die umfassende Museumsausstellung des Parks.

DU: Ik heb al eerder Arnhem bezocht, maar het was in 2001, en dan probeerde ik niet Nederlands te praten - en dit keer sprak ik de taal alleen als ik onze zookaartjes heb gekocht. Het is echter waarschijnlijk dat ik weer reist naar de Benelux later dit jaar, op voorwaarde dat ik kan goede aanbiedingen vinden op vliegtickets.

SP: En este momento, veo un programa en TVE sobre el agua. Hemos visitado a los bomberos que tratan de derrotar a los incendios en las montañas, y ahora mismo estamos visitando un dueño de invernaderos que se queja del precio elevado del agua.


Edited by Iversen on 11 April 2012 at 11:07pm

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Fasulye
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 Message 2898 of 3959
12 April 2012 at 12:27am | IP Logged 
Iversen wrote:
GER: Es ist erstaunlich, dass du nicht den archäologischen Park in Xanten besucht hast, der ja zweifelsohne die Hauptattraktion von Xanten ist - und von deinem Standort wenige Kilometer enfernt liegt. Das meiste ist jedoch innerhalb der letzten Jahren gebaut, darunter die umfassende Museumsausstellung des Parks.


DE: Ich bin mit einer speziellen Gruppe von Leuten in Xanten gewesen, die alle wenig Geld hatten und die Zeit für den Ausflug war begrenzt. Insofern gab des keine Möglichkeit für mich diesen Park zu besuchen und es lag auch nicht in meiner Entscheidungsbefugnis. Van der Webseite her sieht der archäologische Park sehr interessant aus, aber mit 9 EUR ist der Eintritt teuer und das Gelände ist groß. Das wäre etwas für einen Tagesausflug, sonst lohnt es sich nicht.

Fasulye

Edited by Fasulye on 12 April 2012 at 1:30pm

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Fasulye
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 Message 2899 of 3959
12 April 2012 at 12:34am | IP Logged 
NL: Ik heb een interessant artikel in de krant gelezen dat ze vrijwilligers zoeken die als toeristengids bezoekers in Krefeld rondleiden op Burg Linn. Deze vrijwilligers worden opgeleid in de geschiedenis van Burg Linn en de bedoeling is dat ze mensen rondleiden in de talen Duits, Engels, Frans en Nederlands. Helaas voldoe ik niet aan de eisen, die voor dit baantje gesteld worden.

Vooral moet je een luide en krachtige stem hebben en mijn stem is meer zacht en ik krijg stemproblemen als ik lang alleen moet spreken. Ook vragen ze dat men ervaring in het omgaan met kinderen heeft. Ik heb wel op scholen gewerkt, maar met kleine kinderen heb ik volstrekt geen ervaring.

En voor dit werk wat toch wel intellectuele eisen stelt, krijg je volstrekt geen financiële vergoeding.

Te graag zou ik Nederlandse toeristen willen rondleiden in mijn eigen stad - voor de taalpraktijk zou dat heel leuk zijn. Maar ik zou daar dan toch wel geld mee willen verdienen(!).

Fasulye

Edited by Fasulye on 12 April 2012 at 12:46am

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Iversen
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 Message 2900 of 3959
12 April 2012 at 10:34am | IP Logged 
DU: Ik denk dat ze te ver gaan wanneer de eigenaars van een burg verwachten dat de vrijwilliger georganiseerde rondleidingen zullen gratis uitvoeren. Het is echter in orde dat vrijwilligers op informele basis praten met bezoekers in ruil voor vrije jaarkaart en andere extraatjes, en het gebeurt in feite op veele plaatsen (hoewel zelden in Denemarken - misschien als gevolg van het starke verzet van de vakbonden).

Fasulye mentioned that a local castel searched volunteers who were supposed to make multilingual tours for free. In Denmark we don't see much of that, probably because the unions find that such services should be done by paid staff, and that is basically also my attitude. However it would be a totally different story if the service rendered in exchange for free admission and other tidbits was to have informal chats with the visitors, including chats in foreign languages.

Actually this system is found in many places around the world. In the USA it is hard to find a zoo or museum without volunteers, but many places in Europe also have them. My sister actually spotted a uniformed person in the Münster Zoo and proceeded to tell him in excruciating detail how the indoor chimpanzee facility really should be equipped, and then it turned out that the poor man just was a volunteer. So now the chimps in all likelihood won't get the additional climbing level in their house which she pleaded for.   


Edited by Iversen on 12 April 2012 at 10:39am

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Iversen
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 Message 2901 of 3959
12 April 2012 at 2:21pm | IP Logged 
IR: Arís eile, tá mé úsáid as abair.ie chun staidéar a dhéanamh ar fhoghraíocht na hÉireann.
again once, am! me use of abair.ie for study (to) doing of pronunciation ofthe Irish
once again I have used abair.ie to study Irish pronunciation
/αr∫ələ , təməwsædj ə∫abrrwə∫a∫anjə hunstα·djαria nüər jαχnəhærə/

When I listened to the sentence above I was puzzled by the sounds that were produced at the basis of "as abair.ie" (the homepage with my preferred Irish speech synthesizer): /ə∫abrrə∫a∫anjə/. Where did that sjanja come from? And I was worried about the almost total implosion of "a dhéanamh ar" to /a nüər/ and of "ar fhoghraíocht na hÉireann" to /ər jαχnəhærə/. It won't be easy to see a system in these reductions and evgen more difficult to predict the outcome.

In between I also learn some grammar and a few idioms. For instance my "staidéar a dhéanamh" is inspired by this sentence on the main page of the abair thing: "Ceadaíonn sé duit sintéis a dhéanamh ar fhocal nó abairtín" (= permits! it to synthesis (to) doing of word or sentence"). If I hadn't seen such examples it would not have occurred to me to include the particle "a" plus the substantival form "deanamh" here - I would simply have juxtaposed "staidéar" and "fhoghraíocht" and crossed my fingers.

In some cases I'm still genuinely surprised by a seemingly irregular pronunciation of something very common. For instance the page at abair also includes this sentence:

Tá treoracha céim-ar-chéim ar fáil sna ceisteanna coitianta.
Is! directions step-by-step at-availability for-the questions common
/ta trwrɔ·χa kæjm-αr-χæjm arf(w)ərsnə kæstjənə kɔrtjanta/

"treoracha" is the plural of "treoir" (= guidance, direction, leadership). Notice that "eo" almost has become a halfwowel /w/ of the kind you also find in some Slavic languages. But the passage I first and foremost noticed in the synthesized speech is "ar fáil sna" - /arf(w)ərsnə/ (notice that the 'l' in my ears sound like 'r' .. and remember the Asians who have problems separating those two letters!). What actually happens is that the tip of the tongue of the electronic green lady hasn't got time to actually touch her palate, and therefore the result is closer to /r/ than to /l/. If I just had listened, but not tried to document the things I heard, I would never have noticed such small details.

One more example:

Tá mé Danmhairgis
Am! I Danish
I am Danish
/tamadanwrjgə∫/

What happened to "Danmhairgis"? Well, 'mh' is pronounced as /w/, and it colours the 'a' to the extent that the final result sounds as a long /u/. And the palatalization of the 'r' turns op as a short /i/ or /j/ sound between 'r' and 'g'.

Maybe learners of Danish would benefit from having a speech synthethizer of the quality of abair at their disposal, but I haven't noticed one - except the one at translate.google.com, which can be used in a pinch, but isn't nearly as pleasant to listen to (although it does sound more humanlike now than when they first had introduced the system - or maybe I have just lowered my expectations).


Edited by Iversen on 13 April 2012 at 10:47am

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Iversen
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 Message 2902 of 3959
16 April 2012 at 1:48pm | IP Logged 
LAT: Mentionem IX Aprilis feci Tabulae Peutingerianae, quae charta est viarum quas fecerunt aut dumtaxat cognoverunt romanii inter Lusitaniam Indiamque. In situ isto elenchum ordine alphabetice datur quae utile sit ut nomina tabulae interpretaret. In situ isto charta hodiernis datur cum itineres veteres et lociis hodiernibus. Tamen tabula vetera non ostentantur, quamobrem utile est etiam tertium situm utere quam antequam non nominabam: Euratlas.net. Hic premere sectionem I (quae facte non in copia erepta est, quamobrem de Conrado Molindario anno domini 1898 modo antiquo restituita est), postea premere in angulo superiore dextre ubi "Francia" videtur et in media parte nomine "Francia" premere .... heureka, hic "colo.." sub "i" Franciae vides, id quod positionem Coloniae Ulpiae Traianae (Xanten) indicat. Scio, cursus lentus erit se per Europam ita peregrinari vis, sed saltim non ambulare sicut milites Romani debes. Et non habetis ad manducandum pabulis eorum.

I mentioned the old Roman map "Tabula Peutingeriana" a week ago (9. April) and gave a few links to sites which show or interpret it. In the Latin section above I repeat the reference to www.omnesviae.org, where you can see the old roads on a modern map, but also give a link www.euratlas.net/cartogra/peutinger to a site which shows a facsimile of the old map (plus the 1898 reconstruction by Konrad Miller of the missing Western part), and finally I have found a list of old Latin place names in alphabetical order with their nearest modern equivalents at www.roman-empire.net/diverse/places.html.

Speaking about maps and travelling, this evening I am going to have a meeting with a Portuguese man who wants to interview me about interrail travels in the old days - I was one of the first who got such a card in 1972. I suppose the interview will be in English, but I see forward also to have a conversation in Portuguese.


Edited by Iversen on 16 April 2012 at 4:15pm

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Iversen
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 Message 2903 of 3959
17 April 2012 at 10:43am | IP Logged 
POR: Fui entrevistado ontem às 19h00 na estação principal de minha cidade como planejado, e a entrevista teve como tema os viegens InterRail. Porém aconteceu que acabamos de falar Inglês porque Sr. Nobre era acompanhado de duas pessoas checas, e embora ele fale fluentemente a lingua checa está fora dà minha competência fala-la.

DA: Det var en del af et projekt hvor 10 interrailister fra forskellige lande er blevet interviewet på deres egne sprog - i mit tilfælde dansk - og så må man formode at der kommer undertekster på den endelige version, som gerne skulle blive færdig til et jubilæum i den Europæiske Jernbaneunion i sommeren 2012. Senere er det planen at filmen skal forsøges solgt til TV-stationer rundt om i Europa. Det var også jubilæumsår i 1972 da jeg købte mit eget første interrailkort, og ingen forventede dengang at det stadig ville eksistere i dag, 40 senere.

I was interviewed yesterday at 19.00 at the main station in my town as planned. However I didn't speak much Portuguese because the two companions of the interviewer were Czechs .. so we ended up speaking English (as usual in such cases). The plan is that 10 old and new interrailists from all over Europe have been/will be interviewed in their own language, and the interviews will be used in a film which according to the plan should be ready for a jubilee in the European Railway Organization in the summer of 2012. Actually I bought my card in its first year of existence in another jubilee year, 1972, so I was 'the oldest' interrailist (or "tågluffa" as the Swedes say) among the interviewees. Besides I was with 9 cards all in all also one of the most assiduous interrailists, and with at least three times 30.000 km per tour I might be up for a honourable mention - but not more than that because the Guinness record is around 37.000 kms in a month.

So the interview itself was a bilingual affair. Mr. Nobre is himself a polyglot who speaks 5 languages fluently, but Danish is not among them so he posed his questions in English and I answered in Danish with a summary in English (like I do here in this thread). Later a Danophone lady in Praha will assist with translations and subtitles of the Danish sections. It is a very interesting project and I'm happy to have a stake somewhere in it. Maybe I'll even be invited to the presentation of the film, which as far as I remember will take place in Leipzig.

Edited by Iversen on 17 April 2012 at 11:28am

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Iversen
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 Message 2904 of 3959
18 April 2012 at 2:00pm | IP Logged 
IR: Chuardach mé ar Google an fhocail "anois" agus fuair sé an dán "Anois teacht an Earraigh" ("Cill Aodain"), a bhfuil an-eolas go maith léir in Éirinn. Tá sé aisteach go nach raibh mé in ann a thabhairt nasc chuig amhrán ar Youtube, ach bhí go leor suímh leis an dán, agus bhí anseo freisin barúlacha gramadaí. Baineann an suíomh gréasáin le fíorúil Gaeilge na scoile, agus tá dócha freisin ábhar úsáideach anseo.

I wanted to find some Irish and searched for "anois" in Google. It returned a lot of references to a poem "Anois teacht an earraigh" by Antaine Ó Reachtabhra, which seems to be an indispensable (or unavoidable) element of the teaching of the Irish language in Irish schools. One of the pages with the poem was better than the others because it also contained a line by line translation with grammatical comments. This page belongs to a site owned by a Gaelic School (Scoil Ghaeilge Ghearóid Tóibín), and it seems that there also are other useful things on their homepage - I'll look further into that aspect later.

Another page was special by 1) playing a shrill tune, 2) by missing one verse in the Irish version - the second one about the Clare of Morris family. Maybe some Mayonnaise citizen removed it because he/she didn't fancy the Clare of Morris family - y'never know.

Besides the translation of the first two lines of the third verse is a prime example of free translation practices - and the two sites use the same translation (after the arrow):

Fágaim le huacht é (I-leave with will it)
go n-éiríonn mo chroé-se (that becomes my heart-he) (..succeeds-in-becoming..)
Mar a éiréonn an ghaoth (As [] rises the wind)
nó mar a scaipeann an ceo (or as [] spreads the fog)
-->
I swear / that my heart rises up
as the wind rises up / or as the fog lifts

Below I quote the first verse of the poem as offered by the www.scoilgaeilge.org site (which also has the missing second verse in Irish):

Anois teacht an earraigh (now coming of the Spring)
beidh an lá ag dul chun síneadh, (the day will be going toward lengthening)
Is tar éis na féil Bríde (and after the feast of Bridget)
ardóidh mé mo sheol. (I shall raise my sail)
Ó chuir mé I mo cheann é (since I put it into my head)
ní chónóidh me choíche (I shall never stay put)
Go seasfaidh mé síos (until I shall stand down)
i lár Chondae Mhaigh Eo (in the center of County Mayo)


Edited by Iversen on 18 April 2012 at 2:37pm



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