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Iversen’s Multiconfused Log (see p.1!)

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Fasulye
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 Message 561 of 3959
24 March 2009 at 5:14pm | IP Logged 
Iversen wrote:
You can mark sections in the pdf-version and copy them to for instance Word, and there you can supply the pagenumbers in a footer, - but it is still a lot of pages to print. Have you tried making the letters on the screen bigger?


EN: If I had a laser printer, I would mind less printing many pages out. Yes, I could make the letters bigger on the screen, but I dont't feel comfortable reading online, even if the size of the letters is more suitable for me. When I study something I want to have a textmarker, pen or pencil in my hand to mark important passages. I also do this when I read my own books. As it is now I can have a superficial look into the book, but this would of course not be enough to extract any relevant knowledge out of it. And that's a pity.

Fasulye-Babylonia

Edited by Fasulye on 24 March 2009 at 5:50pm

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 Message 562 of 3959
25 March 2009 at 12:50am | IP Logged 
RUS: Когда я посетил Москву в прошлом году, я летел с Аэрофлот, и в журналoм Аэрофлотa я прочитал о палеонтологическом музее в Москве. Я не знал этого музея, только старый музей естественной истории в центре, и я потратил много времени, прежде чем я нашел в своем гостиничном номерев телефонной книге. Он был в самом южном крае Москву, и когда я, наконец, получил, я очень был впечатлен. Теперь я потратил некоторое время читая свою домашнюю страницу, www.paleo.ru/museum*, и я бы напомнил о моем посещении. Одна из самых впечатляющих стал ЗАЛом IV, где на трибуне прикреплены семь скелетов Scutosaurus, млекопитающих-ящерица из Пермского периода. В ряду витринных В этой ЗАЛе также видятся остатки живых родственников голубых рыб, Latimeria chalumnae, известное живущее ископаемый. В ЗАЛе V - наиболее крупный экспонат Музея – скелет позднеюрского Диплодока из группы завропод. Длина диплодока достигала 27 м, а вес доходил до 15 тонн. На сайте также форум, но он не очень активно.
Я посетил Москву в три раза, в 1975, 1987 и 2008 годах, это - очень интересное место. Но высокие цены сейчас.

-----------------

When I visited Moscow last year I found a notice in the airflight magazine of Aeroflot about a Paleontological Museum in Moscow. I was puzzled because I only knew the old Museum of Natural History in the center, but after a long search I found the address of the museum in the telephone directory in my hotel room, - it was at the Southern edge of Moscow, near the outer Ring road. When I got down there I was pleasantly surprised. To train my Russian I have now read through much of the homepage of the museum, and this has of course revitalized my memories. Probably the most impressive thing in the museum is a podium with no less than seven Scutosaurs from the late Permian, and in the same room there is a cast of the Blue Fish Latimeria and some rests of its relatives from same period. In the following room you find the largest skeleton in the museum, a 27 m long Diplodocus. The homepage also has a forum, though it is not very active. I have now visited Moscow three times, in 1975, 1987 and 2008, and it is a very interesting place. But prices are high now.

*link corrected

Edited by Iversen on 25 March 2009 at 11:08am

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 Message 563 of 3959
25 March 2009 at 6:41am | IP Logged 
Iversen wrote:
Probably the most impressive thing in the museum is a podium with no less than seven Scutosauri from the late Permian, and in the same room there is a cast of the Blue Fish Latimeria and some rests of its relatives from same period. In the following room you find the largest skeleton in the museum, a 27 m long Diplodocus. The homepage also has a forum, though it is not very active. I have now visited Moscow three times, in 1975, 1987 and 2008, and it is a very interesting place. But prices are high now.


EN: This seems to be a very interesting museum. Your direct link to the museum's website doesn't work, but I gave in the name of the website and had a look on it.Unfortunatley, I had to read "Sorry, the English version is not available yet".And I had a look into the Russian forum, but as I don't have the language knowledge, I don't understand any information from it.

In Germany such museums are called "Naturkundemuseen". I've never been to such a museum yet, but it would interest me. There is the well-known Naturkundemuseum in Bonn (Museum König), but this is outside of my regional ticket. When I was in Bonn some years ago, Museum König was closed due to renovation. There is a Naturkundemuseum in Dortmund and may-be also one in Essen. I will do some internet research on that. With my background knowledge of natural sciences that I have now, it would be worth-while visiting such a museum. Of course I cannot travel to foreign countries to visit museums of natural science there.

Fasulye-Baylonia

Edited by Fasulye on 25 March 2009 at 6:47am

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 Message 564 of 3959
25 March 2009 at 6:49am | IP Logged 
Iversen
Quote:
Когда я посетил Москву в прошлом году, я летел с Аэрофлот, и в журналoм Аэрофлотa я прочитал о палеонтологическом музее в Москве. Я не знал этого музея, только старый музей естественной истории в центре, и я потратил много времени, прежде чем я нашел в своем гостиничном номерев телефонной книге. Он был в самом южном крае Москву, и когда я, наконец, получил, я очень был впечатлен. Теперь я потратил некоторое время читая свою домашнюю страницу, www.paleo.ru/museum, и я бы напомнил о моем посещении. Одна из самых впечатляющих стал ЗАЛом IV, где на трибуне прикреплены семь скелетов Scutosaurus, млекопитающих-ящерица из Пермского периода. В ряду витринных В этой ЗАЛе также видятся остатки живых родственников голубых рыб, Latimeria chalumnae, известное живущее ископаемый. В ЗАЛе V - наиболее крупный экспонат Музея – скелет позднеюрского Диплодока из группы завропод. Длина диплодока достигала 27 м, а вес доходил до 15 тонн. На сайте также форум, но он не очень активно.
Я посетил Москву в три раза, в 1975, 1987 и 2008 годах, это - очень интересное место. Но высокие цены сейчас.


Когда я посетил Москву в прошлом году, я летел Аэрофлотом (i.e. on Aeroflot's plane), и в журнале Аэрофлотa я прочитал о палеонтологическом музее в Москве (better is "о Московском палеонтологическом музее").

Я не знал этот музей ("этого" use for live objects - men, animal etc.), только старый музей естественной истории в центре, и я потратил много времени, прежде чем я нашел адрес этого музея (formally is correct, but we in such cases say, what we found) в своем гостиничном номере в телефонной книге.

Он был на самой южной окраине Москвы (we use the word "окраина"), и когда я, наконец, нашёл его/добрался до него, я очень был впечатлен.

Теперь я потратил некоторое время, читая его домашнюю страницу, www.paleo.ru/museum, и это, конечно, освежило мои воспоминания (I translate this from your English).

Одним из самых впечатляющих стал зал IV, где на постаменте стоят семь скелетов Scutosaurus, ящеров (I don't know what is Scutosaurus, but think that this is the "ящер", not "млекопитающее") Пермского периода.

Next sentence is very difference in comparsion with English, and I can't correct it.

В зале V - (better say "находится", although grammatically all is correct) наиболее крупный экспонат музея – скелет позднеюрского диплодока из группы завропод (In English this is absent).

Длина диплодока достигала 27 м, а вес доходил до 15 тонн.

На сайте (better insert "имеется") также форум, но он не очень активен.

Я посетил Москву (without "в") три раза, в 1975, 1987 и 2008 годах, (better insert "и") это - очень интересное место. Но высокие цены сейчас (this is correct, but we say "но сейчас высокие цены").
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 Message 565 of 3959
25 March 2009 at 10:23am | IP Logged 
Thank you for the corrections. I'm aware that there are places where the English version differs rather substantially, but the goal would of course be that you don't have to check it - it is only meant as a summary, and I write it from memory after I have posted the 'target language' version. A major factor behind several errors is that I normally do know what I want to express and I look up a word or two in search of a useful formula, but my dictionaries sometimes lead me astray, and my idiomatic sense isn't yet developed enough to catch those errors. The resultat can be somewhat cryptic. Other errors are due to influence from other languages, - for instance "forum" is neuter in Latin so I forgot that it is a masculine noun in Russian. Such things happen even when I write in English (or Danish), but there I spot them almost immediately - in Russian I may overlook them.

An example: the phrase "и я бы напомнил о моем посещении" was intended to mean something vaguely like "and I felt it as if I were there again" or "I recalled my (feeling of) being there". But as the correction suggests this was taken to mean that I actively refreshed my memory, - almost, but not quite the same thing.

About the Scutosaurus: this is the original description of the display, taken from the homepage of the museum (http://www.paleo.ru/museum/hall4.html)

"Основу экспозиции галереи составляют смонтированные на едином подиуме семь скелетов парейазавров Scutosaurus karpinski, Scutosaurus tuberculatus, черепа парейазавров и скелет горгонопса- иностранцевии Inostrancevia alexandri."

I suspected that the term 'Pareiasaurs' wasn't too well known outside paleontological circles so I just indicated the Scutosaurians as members of a group of mammal-like reptiles from the Permian, i.e. from the time before the Dinosaurs. The Gorgonops belong to the same group, affectionately called "headbangers" by the American paleontologist Bob Bakker. The Sauropods, including Diplodocus, was a group of gigantic plant-eating dinosaurs from the Jurassic period with long tails and long necks.

The sentence "В ряду витринных В этой зале также видется остатки живых родственников голубых рыб, Latimeria chalumnae, известное живущее ископаемый." was intended to mean something like "In row B of vitrines in this hall* (there are) also shown rests of animals (who were) relatives of the 'Blue fish' Latimeria chalumna, (the/a) wellknown living fossil". But apparently something went wrong: I used the adjective "живой" ('living') but had the adjectival substantive "живное" (animal, from "живный") in mind, - and the relatives of Latimeria have been stonedead for hundreds of millions of years. Besides "известное живущее ископаемый" should probably be "известный живущий ископаемый". Arrgh.

*this precise indication is of course taken from the homepage

Of course it is easier to ask for the blue bag of potato chips in a shop (= my exact conversational level when I visited Moscow last year), and I would commit fewer errors by staying at that level, - but I would also feel it to be a major limitation of not only my writings, but also the thoughts behind them, so I'll continue to write things that are too complicated for me, and someday my skills will hopefully catch up with my intentions.

Again thank you for the corrections, I learn a lot from analyzing them


Edited by Iversen on 26 March 2009 at 12:12am

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 Message 566 of 3959
25 March 2009 at 12:27pm | IP Logged 
Iversen
Quote:
An example: the phrase "и я бы напомнил о моем посещении" was intended to mean something vaguely like "and I felt it as if I were there again" or rather "and I recalled my (feeling of) being there"


This may be translated as, for example, "и я как будто вновь оказался там (i.e. in museum)". "И я бы напомнил о моем посещении" is grammatically correct, but it means quite other ("And I were remind somebody about my visit"; I don't sure that I correct translate your Russian sentence to English: this is subjunctive mood, past tense).

The word "трибуна" uses mainly as designation of place where speaker stand and say his speech. Of course, the ancient reptilies aren't speakers, and its remains can't stand on "трибуна" but can stand on "подиум".

The word "млекопитающее" uses as designation of the mammal animals only. I'm not a zoologist, but I think that ancient animals (about which you wrote) aren't the mammal animals, they are reptilies. In Russian "reptile" is "рептилия" or "пресмыкающееся" (the first word is more "special", "scientific", and uses usually by well-educated people).

Quote:
The sentence "В ряду витринных В этой ЗАЛе также видятся остатки живых родственников голубых рыб, Latimeria chalumnae, известное живущее ископаемый." was intended to mean something like "In row B of vitrines in this hall* (there are) also rests of animals (who are) relatives of the 'Blue fish' Latimeria chalumna, (the/a) wellknown living fossil". But apparently something went wrong


In your Russian sentence are some mistakes. The right translation from English may be this: "В этом зале в витринах ряда B находятся также останки животных, родственных "голубой рыбе" Latimeria chalumna, хорошо известному "живому ископаемому"". Yours "живых родственников" means that these relatives of Latimeria are alive now, in our days. I use the first quotes ("голубой рыбе") since "голубая рыба" isn't the real name of this animal, this is "nickname" (the real name is "латимерия" i.e. copy from Latin). The second quotes ("живому ископаемому") uses since Latimeria is lived now and isn't the real fossil, although all of its relatives vanished many thousand years ago.
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 Message 567 of 3959
25 March 2009 at 1:23pm | IP Logged 
Thank you again for taking the time to analyse my phrases, - " хорошо известному "живому ископаемому"" is certainly a good solution to my problem, and I also understand the problem with "я бы напомнил о моем посещении"" better now.

During my search for a suitable Russian name for the mammalian reptiles I discovered a gross non-linguistic error in my text: the Gorgonopses were in fact members of the group "Therapsida", a subgroup of the Synapsids, while Scutosaurus was a member of the Anapsids. So Scutosaurus was not a mammalian reptile at all, but in all likelihood a far relative of the turtles. In contrast we all descend from the animals in the group of Therapsids and none of the true reptiles do, so logically the Therapsida - Терапсиды- shouldn't be called reptiles at all in any language, and not even mammalian reptiles ("pattedyrøgler" in Danish, звероящеры in Russian) - but this habit is clearly hard to break. This is a problem because it's effectively our own common distant family name that is in jeopardy!

Birds (representing the last surviving group of dinosaurs), lizards, snakes, crocs and the sole remaining species of the tuatara are all members of the third big group, the Diapsids. And Anapsids, Synapsids and Diapsids are all members of the larger group of the Amniotes, those with hard eggshells.

Russian Wikipedia has a long article about the Скутозавры (the singular is "Скутозавр"). Alas, during my search for the Russian nameforms I found to my grief that my homebrewed expression "млекопитающих-ящерица" already has found its treacherous way into Google, - I don't hope that people out there will start using that expression now! Sometimes that Google-thing is just too fast.


Edited by Iversen on 26 March 2009 at 12:15am

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 Message 568 of 3959
25 March 2009 at 8:38pm | IP Logged 
DAS ULTIMATIVE DINOSAURIER - MUSEUM IN DEUTSCHLAND

DE: Ich habe etwas ganz Tolles im Internet ausgegraben: Anscheinend gibt es in diesem Land ein - ganz neues - phänomenales Dinosaurier Museum in der Nähe von Saarbrücken (Bundesland Saarland). Es sieht ganz nach einem multimedialem Museum aus.

Die Webseite dazu: www.gondwana-praehistorium.de


Folgendes kann man dort erleben:

1 Eingangshalle
Mit über 8m Höhe und 40m Länge begrüßt Sie der Argentinosaurus in den Hallen von GONDWANA – Das Praehistorium.

2 Kino
Erleben Sie über 8 Milliarden Jahre, vom Urknall bis zu den ersten Lebensformen auf der Erde.

3 Zeit des Präkambriums
Blaugrüne Bakterien bilden im flachen Meer große Kalkstein-Gebilde, die Stromatolithen. Erleben Sie die frühe mikrobielle Biosphäre im UV-Licht.

4 Zeit des Jungpräkambriums und Kambriums
Die ersten großen Organismen erscheinen. Modelle von Quallen, räuberischen Gliederfüßlern und Mikroplankton geben einen Eindruck des frühen, vielzelligen Lebens.

5 Silur-Zeit
Tauchen Sie ab in die Welt der Urmeere. Hier, in der Höhle eines „Korallen“-Riffes vor 420 Millionen Jahren, beginnt unsere Reise durch die Urzeitlandschaften.

6 Devon-Zeit
Die ersten Tier- und Pflanzenformen wagen den Schritt aus dem Wasser ans Land. Eine Welt, die 400 Millionen Jahre vor unserer Zeitrechnung liegt.

7 Karbon-Zeit
Durchstreifen Sie den feucht-nebligen Steinkohle-Sumpfwald, der von der Tropensonne durchstrahlt wird. Hier haben Riesenlibellen und Tausendfüßler-Giganten ihren Lebensraum gefunden.

8 Perm-Zeit
Durchwandern Sie eine steilwandige Felsenschlucht der Halb-wüste und werden Sie Zeuge einer brachialen Sturzflut.

9 Trias-Zeit
Nun beginnt sie, die Zeit der Dinosaurier. Gefräßige krokodil-ähnliche Saurier lauern in den Flußarmen des Urwaldes auf ihre Beute.

10 Jura-Zeit
Eine 150 Millionen Jahre alte Rifflandschaft erinnert an die heutige Südsee. Unterschätzen Sie jedoch nicht die ungeahnten Gefahren dieser stillen und friedlich scheinenden Lagune.

11 Unterkreide-Zeit
Südpolarlicht erleuchtet den nächtlichen Himmel der winterlichen Landschaft. In einer Baumstammhöhle schützen sich Dinosaurier vor der klirrenden Kälte.

12 Oberkreide-Zeit
Hier erleben Sie ihn: einen der größten und gefährlichsten Räuber der Urzeit. Tyrannosaurus wacht über der frisch erlegten Beute und verteidigt aggressiv und drohend sein Revier.

13 4D Kino
Werden Sie Zeuge des großen Aussterbens der letzen Dino-saurier. Hier endet auch unsere Zeitreise durch 4,5 Milliarden Jahre Erdgeschichte.

14 Interaktive Zone
Erleben Sie in virtuellen Welten den Beutezug der Flugsaurier und Libellen. Oder entdecken Sie als Forscher Überreste des vorzeitigen Lebens.

Leider ist das Saarland ziemlich weit weg von NRW und für mich daher nicht erreichbar. Das ist richtig schade!

Was ist dein Eindruck von diesem Museum, Iversen?

Fasulye-Babylonia

Edited by Fasulye on 25 March 2009 at 8:47pm



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